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Wayland-Based Chromium Browser Released

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  • #16
    And suddenly...

    Wayland is a workable alternative for probably 80% of the typical users day-to-day work

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    • #17
      I’m curious about the amount of work needed to port an application to use Wayland. A team at Intel needed 2 months to partially port Chromium which already had an abstraction layer…

      Also I never remember what problems Wayland is supposed to fix. I went to their web site to read some doc two days ago but nothing sticked in my mind.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by stqn View Post
        I’m curious about the amount of work needed to port an application to use Wayland. A team at Intel needed 2 months to partially port Chromium which already had an abstraction layer…

        Also I never remember what problems Wayland is supposed to fix. I went to their web site to read some doc two days ago but nothing sticked in my mind.
        well, a team can have many responsibilities ... I also have some (rather small) "pet" features in the pipeline here at work which started a month ago but got burried under other work because of other priorities (and eg. get 3-4 hours a week tops). As for advantages, the biggest one imo is simply that all the legacy x11 features which are no longer used by real-world apps are gone which leads to a way smaller codebase (which has thus - statistically speaking - less bugs). Jeah, the architecture is nice and has some nifty features (tear-free rendering as an example), but I dont worry about that so much as about a huge-ass piece of code that has dubious quality (I remember reading about some x.org releases not even compiling) and runs in kernel-mode at the same time.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by stqn View Post
          I’m curious about the amount of work needed to port an application to use Wayland. A team at Intel needed 2 months to partially port Chromium which already had an abstraction layer…

          Also I never remember what problems Wayland is supposed to fix. I went to their web site to read some doc two days ago but nothing sticked in my mind.
          Maybe the web browser is not properly the most correct example, because it touches one of that particular case where subsurfaces are needed.
          Other than that, there is an additional difficulty in case the browser's toolkit has not been ported yet (I don't remember if chromium uses gtk+ 2 or what).
          I guess that, excepts for video player (maybe another subsurfaces case), the porting effort from X to Wayland should't be so hard.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by stqn View Post
            I’m curious about the amount of work needed to port an application to use Wayland. A team at Intel needed 2 months to partially port Chromium which already had an abstraction layer…

            Also I never remember what problems Wayland is supposed to fix. I went to their web site to read some doc two days ago but nothing sticked in my mind.
            Wayland mostly helps on the developer side, and actually mostly the system or graphic stack developer side.
            For the end user, that means nothing new per se, but possibly more things or better quality things in general (in the future. right now, you'll have as much things, but buggier, until the technology gets fully mature).

            For example, the wayland back-end for the R-Pi uses the GPU's hardware compositor, with an incredible boost in performance. That's something that cannot be done with X.
            It is this kind of little things.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by erendorn View Post
              For the end user, that means nothing new per se, but possibly more things or better quality things in general (in the future.
              Well, I'd say a tear-free desktop without having to slap this compositor extention hack somewhere into the stack like with X is kindof a big thing for end users.

              I somewhere heard that Waylands motto is "every frame is perfect" which is something that sounds pretty cool and desireable for end users.

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              • #22
                Yeah. The big feature for end users is a tear free environment.
                There should be a small performance increase as well.

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                • #23
                  Go watch a youtube video and try to scroll the browser page, if you want to see a concrete example of the benefits of Wayland.

                  Also this is a good reference:

                  http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...ituation&num=1

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by ua=42 View Post
                    Yeah. The big feature for end users is a tear free environment.
                    There should be a small performance increase as well.
                    And it reduce greatly input latency because there is no Vsync and no need to an additional opengl compositor on top of the display server because the compositor IS the display server.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by dee. View Post
                      Go watch a youtube video and try to scroll the browser page, if you want to see a concrete example of the benefits of Wayland.
                      No problem here under Xorg (but I am using compton and the VLC plugin to play youtube videos).

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by dee. View Post
                        Go watch a youtube video and try to scroll the browser page, if you want to see a concrete example of the benefits of Wayland.
                        That's it. I wonder why nobody talked about that earlier given we are talking about a web browser here.

                        The big problem with X are sub-surfaces: There are none. Now the flash player has to be a sub-surface on top of the browsers surface. As X doesn't help here at all the browser itself has to ensure the flash surface moves with the browser while you scroll the website. No matter how good the browser tries to handle this: It will always lag behind.
                        Wayland on the other side fully supports sub-surfaces and ensures that the flash surface moves pixel-perfect while scrolling.

                        So: Are there still people telling they can't see the benefits of Wayland for end users, especially with web browsers?

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                        • #27
                          The old man in me wants to ask: if that's supposed to be a concrete advantage for normal users, why can't those normal users concentrate on that video, but have it both playing (wasting resources) and scroll around ignoring it?

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by curaga View Post
                            The old man in me wants to ask: if that's supposed to be a concrete advantage for normal users, why can't those normal users concentrate on that video, but have it both playing (wasting resources) and scroll around ignoring it?
                            Because they can old man.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by curaga View Post
                              The old man in me wants to ask: if that's supposed to be a concrete advantage for normal users, why can't those normal users concentrate on that video, but have it both playing (wasting resources) and scroll around ignoring it?
                              because who wants to stop a video just to scroll or move around the window? Also its not a matter of wasted ressources but the fundamental flaw of x11 to keep surfaces aligned like they should and this is just an _example_.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by curaga View Post
                                The old man in me wants to ask: if that's supposed to be a concrete advantage for normal users, why can't those normal users concentrate on that video, but have it both playing (wasting resources) and scroll around ignoring it?
                                I sometimes scroll down while the video is playing if it's a song or an informational video that I don't exactly have to watch. But I think this example is just to show an easy way to spot one of the many small issues that build into large annoyances with X11 that Wayland fixes :P

                                Honestly, I think the major reason I'm looking forward to Wayland is the reduction in server blocking because my computer is old/slow enough that it's noticeable

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