Wayland'ized GNOME Shell Gets A Binary

[kigurai]

Are random people on the Internet not real people?

No
Joking aside, they are at least not a random sampling of the GNOME users. I am guessing that a lot of the "haters" are not even using GNOME. Because who the hell is so stupid to use a system they hate when they are not forced. And I am guessing that very few people are forced to use GNOME.

[Daktyl198]

No
Joking aside, they are at least not a random sampling of the GNOME users. I am guessing that a lot of the "haters" are not even using GNOME. Because who the hell is so stupid to use a system they hate when they are not forced. And I am guessing that very few people are forced to use GNOME.

To be fair, I would probably be considered as a GNOME hater by most people here, but I use GNOME almost every release to test the new features and stuff to see if it can draw me back in. Yet, I can honestly say that in my opinion, GNOME 3 is the worst desktop environment for productivity. Hell, even Ubuntu's Unity was way better before 12.04 (11.10 was my favorite version of Ubuntu ever) and 12.04+ only looses because of performance issues (it shouldn't take an entire second to open the freaking dash).

KDE I have no explicit love for either, mind you. It's cluttered and has too much inter-dependence on it's apps and libraries. E.g. if I want to install Konversation, I have to install half of KDE with it. Not to mention that ugly-ass default theme, ugh.
XFCE uses GTK2, and is suuuuuuper ugly by default. Openbox/Fluxbox are beyond too simple for my personal needs.
Cinnamon is what I wish GNOME 3 would have been.

At the moment I'm using XFCE with a heavily customized theme only because XFCE is the default on my current distro (Manjaro). But I distro-hop a lot so that may change soon.

NOTE HOWEVER that I am immensely proud of the GNOME team for pushing Wayland support so far so fast. It just goes to show that they have a great team of developers who can write great code.
They just have a horrible team of designers who push the developers to create interfaces that look like crap. GNOME 3 to me seems like it's saying, "Fuck the desktop, nobody uses THAT anymore! It's all MOBILE now!! Who needs notification icons that change color instead of sending you 100 notifications per second for messages in an IRC channel. We'll just HIDE ALL NOTIFICATION ICONS like the worthless shit it is."

Love ya GNOME devs
Hate ya GNOME designers

[Daktyl198]

At least they are passionate about Gnome. They would rather spend their time discussing Gnome on Wayland rather than developing say KDE.

I guess that is a rational thing to do since KDE is dying and Gnome development on Wayland is faster than anything else right now. The haters will flame, but they will be trying it out on wayland anyway. Maybe in secrecy but we all know they are doing it.

I've noticed that you are very passionate about GNOME and very passionate about hating KDE. You are either an extremely good troll, who has studied with masters on how to get people pissed, or so passionate about GNOME that you view KDE as a rival somehow...

I'm questioning why there has to be one or the other, and why they can't just co-exist.

Also, KDE development is happening quite fast as well, it just doesn't happen to be on Micheal's news-worthy radar full of Wayland stuff. Instead, it's on completely re-vamping their internal structure to make it not suck, which is long overdue. After that happens, THEN comes the features, including complete Wayland support.

Do remember that KDE had the beginnings of Wayland support long before GNOME, and commend them for that.

[finalzone]

Yet, I can honestly say that in my opinion, GNOME 3 is the worst desktop environment for productivity..

Could you list the reason for productivity issue?

Cinnamon is what I wish GNOME 3 would have been.

Have you tried the Classic Gnome interface introduced in Gnome 3.8? For you information, gnome-tweak-tool comes by default in 3.10.

GNOME 3 to me seems like it's saying, "Fuck the desktop, nobody uses THAT anymore! It's all MOBILE now!! Who needs notification icons that change color instead of sending you 100 notifications per second for messages in an IRC channel. We'll just HIDE ALL NOTIFICATION ICONS like the worthless shit it is."

Gnome Shell still retains the classic desktop paradigm under different appearance and removal of clutters. Notifications are stacked by applications. If you got many of them non stacked from the same applications, it is likely a bug. Note you can restore the classic notification through extensions or using the Classic Mode.

[Daktyl198]

Could you list the reason for productivity issue?

Several things, actually. Switching windows without using the keyboard shortcut requires either pressing the super key or moving your mouse all the way to a corner. Or installing an extension.
As noted before, all notification icons for applications are hidden in a bar inside the... idk what to call it, so let's refer to it as the "Dash". So say I'm using Konversation, and I set the notification to tell me of channel activity without blowing up in my face with notifications and/or sounds, but by simply changing color. I have to press a button or move my mouse into a corner to check to see if it changed color instead of simply looking down/up/wherever. Or I could install an extension...
I also can't quickly open my favorite applications without, you guessed it, pressing the super key or moving my mouse to the corner. Unless I installed a dock or extension, but I don't like docks. I greatly enjoy the ability to put my applications directly on my main system bar. To be fair, I feel Windows 7 did this the best out of any OS/interface I've ever seen ever.

There are a few other things, but it's 4am so explaining them might get kinda hard to understand for you haha. Spelling and grammar go out the window after 10pm for me.

Have you tried the Classic Gnome interface introduced in Gnome 3.8? For you information, gnome-tweak-tool comes by default in 3.10.

I have. It looks exactly like GNOME 2. I don't want GNOME 2 haha, I want innovation. Plus, from my experience, it's not very customizable.
And I know GNOME-tweak-tool comes by default in 3.10 and that's awesome. There are a few settings in it that I wish would be moved to the main settings application, however.

Gnome Shell still retains the classic desktop paradigm under different appearance and removal of clutters. Notifications are stacked by applications. If you got many of them non stacked from the same applications, it is likely a bug. Note you can restore the classic notification through extensions or using the Classic Mode.

...huh? GNOME 3 is completely geared for mobile/touch. It retains a "few" classic desktop paradigms, but it threw most of them out the window (including a lot that were very popular and useful) in favor of a "super simple interface".
I get that GNOME 3 is very extensible, and that's awesome, but you shouldn't HAVE to use an extension to view notification icons (not notifications themselves) on the GNOME bar.

Again, most of this is just my opinion based on my personal experiences with it :/

P.S. did they ever get any use out of that single-button application menu? I know from 3.0 > 3.6 the only option it had was "quit application".

[danielnez1]

They only fun part is guys like you. It is a great study on people in total denial. KDE is dying because the developers are moving away.

There you go again making statements with no evidence yet again. No doubt you will be adding Psychology to your list of self-asserted "expertise" along with software licences.

[Teho]

You are clearly frustrated about KDE's decline.

They are just mad because KDE is dying now, and they envy Gnome.

It is a great study on people in total denial.

I love how you project your own emotions to others. Of course this is really about your own frustration about the situation with Gnome and GTK where applications and environments are moving away from it. Of course you fear that Gnome is dying while KDE is moving foward with Qt/KF5. Of course you know it even yourself that you are person in denial. I feel bad for people taking you seriously. You are a laughing-stock.

[danielnez1]

I forgive you for the harsh ad hominem attacks. You are clearly frustrated about KDE's decline. Now excuse me, Im having alot of fun playing around with Gnome on wayland. There is some rough edges, so I can't spend more time discussing the ever advancing decay of your dying software. Have fun in your world of contributor agreements and oldfartX.

I was merely pointing out a fact, but please do continue your ranting.

[mrugiero]

Regular users already use Linux through Android invalidating your point.

His point is still valid, because they use Android because it comes with the phone. Most of them don't even know they are running Linux.
DEs are targeted to desktops. Almost none of the desktop/laptop computers come with Linux installed, and yet most of the ones which comes with it can be purchased with Windows, too. And again, regular users usually buy Windows computers. Linux was always for professionals and enthusiasts, along with people who wasn't able to pay a Windows copy and didn't want (or lacked the know-how) to use a pirated copy.
Having said this, there is a slight intersection between regular users (as in technical knowledge) and enthusiasts, but they usually go with vanilla Ubuntu.

Done in practice. Problem is preinstallation and manipulation of consumer desktop market by proprietary companies like Microsoft by hook and crook.

Actually, not. There are things at which Linux kicks Windows' ass, but there are still things where it's the other way around, like power management. The point about the manipulation and installing is true, though.

[mrugiero]

The only complaints I have heard from real people switching to G3 (i.e. not random people on the Internet) is "it doesn't look like it used to". None of them have switched to something else, and everyone seems happy about it.

Well, my brother switched exactly because of that; he liked the old vanilla Ubuntu look. I'd switched anyway, because I like to test different DEs and while doing that I met XFCE and loved it. This doesn't mean I dislike GNOME, but XFCE fits me better.

Have you tried the Classic Gnome interface introduced in Gnome 3.8? For you information, gnome-tweak-tool comes by default in 3.10.

I didn't know about it, thanks. I'll install it for my brother to give it a try. I saw some pics and I think he's gonna love it