GNOME's GTK+ 3.10 Irons Out HiDPI, Wayland Support

[Nobu]

Qt.

Get it right.

It seems like a good third of your posts are one of the following: "It's Qt, not QT," "Fuck you," "Shut up" or some such.

Now, I'm not one to judge, but it would be nice to see less of (at least) the latter. I could stand to see less of the first, as it's off topic, but I at least understand where you're coming from on that one.

(Back on topic,) as far as KDE vs gnome, or Qt vs GTK (when did the discussion switch from desktops to toolkits, or from gnome to desktops in general for that matter?)...they'll each have their own niches. gnome, a more enterprise desktop, will likely stick to desktops (and possibly tablets), whereas KDE (which doesn't appear to have as much use in enterprise settings, not to say that it is unused there) will stretch out more, to other platforms and other operating systems. The toolkits which underlie these DEs will, for obvious reasons, have their development sway somewhat to allow them to function as needed, be that licensing or code wise. I see nothing wrong with either, and don't see why you are all attacking them for what they are (apparently) compelled to do.

[Marc Driftmeyer]

GTK does fine. More contributors than ever, and a future merge with Clutter is nearing. No need to doom stuff that is doing fine. If you are looking for a toolkit losing its developers go look at Qt5, most of the Nokia-effect is gone now and the amount of contributors are dropping rapidly. Anyway I can't see what all this Qt talk has to do with Gnome being dead or alive. Qt is totally out of the question because it is controlled by one company and handicapped by non-free contributor agreements. Qt is the same wrong answer as MIR.

Not to mention each time Nvidia does a beta update in Debian Experimental I can count on KDM to crap the bed until a fix is issued, but the latest GNOME runs just fine.

[flecht]

Debian Experimental

It's not called experimental without reason.

[danielnez1]

(GNOME) is now leading Wayland/Weston development.

Wow, that has got to be one of the biggest gross exaggerations ever.

[Teho]

Focusing on Linux is feature and not a bug.

...and Qt does. It even has support for DirectFB, Wayland, Android and X.org on Linux. It supports GTK+ themes allowing proper cross-desktop integration with non-Qt Linux environments. That doesn't mean it shouldn't support other platforms.

Why on Earth should this layer grow to become a single companys business?

Well luckily it isn't a single company's business but rather a open community with many contributors.

I care about Linux Desktop, not about some tool kit which motives are vastly different than buildong the best possible free Linux Desktop software.

Eh... I don't see there being any conflict between the best intrest of Linux desktop and Qt.

[Teho]

Are you saying that be multiplatform doesn't hurt Linux?

Yes? It's absolute necessarity for the success of Linux. There's no high profile Linux apps that aren't cross-platform and that's no suprise; it's hard to motivate people to write software for a single, relatively small, platform when you could as well write it for everyone. The possibility of using same software on both Windows and Linux eases the transition from Windows to Linux.

It is not a free community. You can't contribute to Qt Free. You have to contribute to Qt which is non-free.

Qt is free software under LGPLv2.1+ and GPLv3 licenses. The Qt commercial licensing doesn't change that.

Ok let us make a bet. I provide you with a link where Qt's interests are put ahead of the best practice of Desktop Linux. If I can do that, will you stop using either Linux or Qt?

That makes absolutely no sense...

[danielnez1]

-and now is the time for you to provide some evidence. Show us some links that justifies any other desktop gives back at least as much as Gnome. Gnome did the work on HiDPI and CM.

You are the one who is coming out with with the grandiose claims about how GNOME is "leading" Wayland development. The burden is on you to back up your ludicrous claims you keep spewing out, though I doubt you will.

[Teho]

There is a difference between making apps multiplatform and having a tool kit taking it to the extreme. Qt want to make app code do "write once, deploy everywhere" That is NOT what Linux needs. Linux should never compromise on this.

I don't see what the problem is supposed to be. Are you suggesting we should pick an inferior toolkit because Qt has too good multiplatform support?

Qt's community is not free it is more like "work for free".

Only that the end product is under LGPLv2.1 and GPLv3 license... if it ever comes down to it you are free to fork it.

Sure it does. If Qt's business is orthogonal to Linux's freedom, then it is fair to ask you Qt endorsers to pick future. Either you go Linux or you go Qt. And Im asking if you are ready to do that.

Linux is a kernel and Qt is an application framework; they aren't mutually exclusive. Both are openly developed open source software.

Can you give similar examples of another desktop pulling something like this?

That doesn't mean that Gnome is leading the Wayland developement... It's for the most part developed by Intel and Collabora not by Gnome project.

[danielnez1]

That doesn't mean that Gnome is leading the Wayland developement... It's for the most part developed by Intel and Collabora not by Gnome project.

Thanks Teho, that was my point exactly.

[danielnez1]

HiDPI and CM was not developed by GNOME developers. So your point is moot. Now give us a few examples of other desktops development, or keep quite.

Right, so some GNOME developers have done some upstream work, how on earth does that mean GNOME are leading the way with Wayland development? Please elaborate.