Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

A New X.Org-Free Wayland LiveCD Released

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by deadite66 View Post
    I wanted to test it but baulked at downloading 1.8GB, way too big.
    Chicken

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by nerdopolis View Post
      There should be a networkmanager, but you have to start it manually. It should be in the panel at the top, as the wifi icon next to the speaker icon.
      Yeah, found it!

      The demo browser contained some 'artwork' homepage. I almost had my Phoronix post ready from the LiveCD until it crashed . Seems like programs are not capable of restarting.
      • Most applications (XWayland only?) contain no window buttons (maximize, close, minimize)
      • Focus works when clicking, but no autofocus
      • Drop-down menu's still show up somewhat randomly
      • Knetworkmanager flickers heavily
      • Cannot provide screenshot as both the demobrowser and Firefox fail with the error 'No Javascript' (I tried to use ctrlv.in)
      • Assuming the demobrowser was Wayland native, it worked pretty good already!
      • No mousewheel scrolling in terminal (Wayland native?)
      • No window bar
      • Dragging and click to focus works...

      Apps are having issue's, like:

      Code:
      beccaholic@beccaholic:/$ ksnapshot
      ksnapshot: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libkipi.so.10: undefined symbol: _ZNK13KXMLGUIClient13componentDataEv
      beccaholic@beccaholic:/$
      Too bad, cannot post screenshots . Furthermore, I think the LiveCD would be more accessible if the author used a cli.seed and build further on that. The entire KDE suite seems to be installed (who cares?)

      Final note: Posted from (X)Wayland! Now, back to the 80's...

      EDIT: Quitting the browser from within (File -> Exit) does not work (lol!).
      Last edited by Rexilion; 05-26-2013, 06:25 AM.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by valeriodean View Post
        Your statement is in contradiction with itself: in the first part you declare it as pointless when in the second part you just to show off what it is the point. Take a decision.
        Plumbing layer...is it the new definition of display server? :-)
        And I still stand by what I said: it is moronic to waste time on a distribution that shows off just one single piece of software. Learn to read bro.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Rexilion View Post
          Yeah, found it!

          The demo browser contained some 'artwork' homepage. I almost had my Phoronix post ready from the LiveCD until it crashed . Seems like programs are not capable of restarting.
          • Most applications (XWayland only?) contain no window buttons (maximize, close, minimize)
          • Focus works when clicking, but no autofocus
          • Drop-down menu's still show up somewhat randomly
          • Knetworkmanager flickers heavily
          • Cannot provide screenshot as both the demobrowser and Firefox fail with the error 'No Javascript' (I tried to use ctrlv.in)
          • Assuming the demobrowser was Wayland native, it worked pretty good already!
          • No mousewheel scrolling in terminal (Wayland native?)
          • No window bar
          • Dragging and click to focus works...

          Apps are having issue's, like:

          Code:
          beccaholic@beccaholic:/$ ksnapshot
          ksnapshot: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libkipi.so.10: undefined symbol: _ZNK13KXMLGUIClient13componentDataEv
          beccaholic@beccaholic:/$
          Too bad, cannot post screenshots . Furthermore, I think the LiveCD would be more accessible if the author used a cli.seed and build further on that. The entire KDE suite seems to be installed (who cares?)

          Final note: Posted from (X)Wayland! Now, back to the 80's...

          EDIT: Quitting the browser from within (File -> Exit) does not work (lol!).
          Based on your experience I can assume that Wayland and XWayland are still not ready for adoption by the end-user?

          Faults like having no chrome, no buttons and menus that don't work properly (can't even quit) does not sound anything close to 'usable' as of now.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by asdx
            Ok sorry, I love Wayland, and I like that this distro is nice way to test it, I just can't stand all these Justin Bieber, Rebecca Black, Hannah Montana names for Linux distros, I mean, I'm sick of it.
            I'm sorry you are still suffering from childhood neglect issue's. Get help.

            Originally posted by ворот93 View Post
            And I still stand by what I said: it is moronic to waste time on a distribution that shows off just one single piece of software. Learn to read bro.
            Yeah, testing new inventions before releasing them to the general public for production deployment. How stupid.

            Please, take your frustrations elsewhere.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
              Based on your experience I can assume that Wayland and XWayland are still not ready for adoption by the end-user?

              Faults like having no chrome, no buttons and menus that don't work properly (can't even quit) does not sound anything close to 'usable' as of now.
              Nope, I guess it's all mostly related to the toolkits implementing corresponding Wayland functionality. However, as I pointed out above: The .iso itself seems to suffer from some issue's not directly related to wayland (e.g. the undefined symbol error). If this is experience is a hard baseline for the quality of Wayland, then (IMHO) we are almost there.

              For those who want to play with the CD, it's mostly a Kubuntu LiveCD with two added packages:
              • wayland-rbos
              • weston-rbos

              You can play with them by listing their contents like this:
              Code:
              dpkg -L wayland-rbos | less
              I managed to find some more examples and stuff. Also the launcher contains a Wayland specific subsection containing the demo's (altough, many of them don't seem to work).

              EDIT: You also mentioned 'chrome'. I guess you are referring to 'Google Chrome'. That is a case apart (from what I have heard) as it uses some direct X calls bypassing the toolkits. So it will take an effort of the Google developers to make it work on Wayland. Don't know when that will happen though... This also depends on how much is actually bypassing the toolkits.
              Last edited by Rexilion; 05-26-2013, 07:23 AM.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by ворот93 View Post
                And I still stand by what I said: it is moronic to waste time on a distribution that shows off just one single piece of software. Learn to read bro.
                I'm not your bro and I don't need to read a stupid statement more time than one.
                The display server is pretty important and wayland is a topic under discussion by months, so for who is interested in the new display server, an X.Org-free distro has all the reason for exist, instead of your useless opinion on how the people should use their time.


                For who needs to do a screenshot:
                clicking on the INFO icon on the top bar, you can see all the keybind of weston, such as the screenshot (super + s, if I remember right) and record a video (maybe super +r?), etc

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by valeriodean View Post
                  For who needs to do a screenshot:
                  clicking on the INFO icon on the top bar, you can see all the keybind of weston, such as the screenshot (super + s, if I remember right) and record a video (maybe super +r?), etc
                  I tried 'Windows_key + S' and it seemed to do something (nothing visual). I tried to paste it at ctrlv.in but it would not work as the site claims that Javascript is disabled (which is not). I did not find any other suitable piece of software to do this.

                  I did verify that the executable to create screenshots is there.

                  I also tried KDE's screencapture. Started the first time, hanged when I pressed the button to make a screenshot. Never started afterwards.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by valeriodean View Post
                    For who needs to do a screenshot:
                    clicking on the INFO icon on the top bar, you can see all the keybind of weston, such as the screenshot (super + s, if I remember right) and record a video (maybe super +r?), etc
                    Hmm, speaking of which, does ffmpeg x11grab work on Wayland, or will there be a "wgrab"?

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Rexilion View Post

                      Apps are having issue's, like:

                      Code:
                      beccaholic@beccaholic:/$ ksnapshot
                      ksnapshot: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libkipi.so.10: undefined symbol: _ZNK13KXMLGUIClient13componentDataEv
                      beccaholic@beccaholic:/$
                      Too bad, cannot post screenshots . Furthermore, I think the LiveCD would be more accessible if the author used a cli.seed and build further on that. The entire KDE suite seems to be installed (who cares?)

                      Final note: Posted from (X)Wayland! Now, back to the 80's...

                      EDIT: Quitting the browser from within (File -> Exit) does not work (lol!).
                      To get KDE apps to work, you have to run them from the xterm xwayland app, because I have it set to use the default variables. The wayland terminal has the /opt in it's library paths. ...KDE apps crash because I have KDE frameworks in /opt (or you can just run
                      xwaylandapp konsole
                      for example to get an x program started with the default variables)

                      As for the screenshot, the Super+s, should save the screenshot in your /home/username . The built in screenshooter tool that comes with weston does not have a GUI,

                      and because of security, only special apps called directly by weston itself, like the weston screenshooter have access to capture the entire display, so that's why ksnapshot won't work.
                      Last edited by nerdopolis; 05-26-2013, 08:39 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by deadite66 View Post
                        I wanted to test it but baulked at downloading 1.8GB, way too big.
                        I'm sorry. I do have lots of dev packages installed, as well as Wayland versions of lots of software like Qt, Gtk, SDL, mplayer, and gstreamer.

                        I put back in my script what builds a smaller ISO without the dev packages.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Great, many thanks.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Rexilion View Post
                            EDIT: You also mentioned 'chrome'. I guess you are referring to 'Google Chrome'. That is a case apart (from what I have heard) as it uses some direct X calls bypassing the toolkits. So it will take an effort of the Google developers to make it work on Wayland. Don't know when that will happen though... This also depends on how much is actually bypassing the toolkits.
                            No, by 'chrome' i refer to the window decorator / window bar (which is also called the chrome in some circles) that contains the 'X', minimize and maximize buttons, which you mentioned was also missing in many application windows.

                            If i wanted Chrome / Chromium I would roll my own build using upstream sources and not download a binary version, just because I can (even though it takes 9 hours to build the browser on my ancient processor). Which i doubt is even possible on Rebecca Black at this point of time without access to the whole chunk of development libraries Chromium demands for the build process.
                            Last edited by Sonadow; 05-26-2013, 11:03 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
                              No, by 'chrome' i refer to the window decorator / window bar (which is also called the chrome in some circles) that contains the 'X', minimize and maximize buttons, which you mentioned was also missing in many application windows.
                              Ah, I see. Well, Weston is there and so (I expect) that functionality to be there to (is it called the chrome? really? confusing.. anyway, thanks for clearing that up). But I suppose that not all the toolkits are fully ported (or contain bugs).

                              Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
                              If i wanted Chrome / Chromium I would roll my own build using upstream sources and not download a binary version, just because I can (even though it takes 9 hours to build the browser on my ancient processor). Which i doubt is even possible on Rebecca Black at this point of time without access to the whole chunk of development libraries Chromium demands for the build process.
                              It's a stock modified Ubuntu install disk. You could do a install build-dep of the chromium package and roll your own source. Should not be much more work than a 'traditional' installed Ubuntu.

                              Originally posted by nerdopolis View Post
                              To get KDE apps to work, you have to run them from the xterm xwayland app, because I have it set to use the default variables. The wayland terminal has the /opt in it's library paths. ...KDE apps crash because I have KDE frameworks in /opt (or you can just run
                              xwaylandapp konsole
                              for example to get an x program started with the default variables)
                              xterm wayland app? I did find 'an' xterm in the launcher which did not work. The Wayland terminal worked good. What surprises me, is that konsole works really good. It has the close, minimize and maximize buttons. And scrolling with my mousewheel works. Furthermore, it does not crash when saving to clipboard (which Firefox did).

                              Originally posted by nerdopolis View Post
                              As for the screenshot, the Super+s, should save the screenshot in your /home/username . The built in screenshooter tool that comes with weston does not have a GUI,
                              I tried Windows+S, Alt+S, Ctrl+S (who knows?) and a button which indicates a menu and an arrow selecting one if it's entries ... + S . None worked, I checked /home/beccaholic and /root. No dice. I also switched tty's to see if Wayland complained, which was not the case (I don't see a .xsession-errors? is there an equivalent?). Also, TTY switching made the Wayland session crash for the first time for me.

                              Having said that, it recovers pretty fast though.

                              Originally posted by nerdopolis View Post
                              and because of security, only special apps called directly by weston itself, like the weston screenshooter have access to capture the entire display, so that's why ksnapshot won't work.
                              That's 'interesting'. So, Xwayland will not be able to handle screenshoting/recording apps, I guess?

                              Thanks for your effort!

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by asdx
                                Bull. Don't confuse me with yourself, idiot.
                                Mirroring your condition on someone else is a first sign that you are still in the acceptance phase of your mental illness. I wish you much luck!

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X