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GNOME Will Move Full-Speed With Wayland Support

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  • #16
    Some people call it fragmentation. I call it selection pressure. Competition is always good for motivating people. Good times ahead!

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    • #17
      1. The Steambox will get released before Mir and therefore certainly rely on X.org
      2. Do you really think Valve would risk using experimental software for their big linux push?
      Originally posted by przemoli View Post
      One more benefit.

      Ubuntu as distro blessed by Valve WILL land in Steam Box. Hence Canonical have BIGGER leverage over AMD/Nvidia to commit to supporting something new in their gpu drivers (or else they risk missing profits from selling GPU's in those Steam Box'es).

      Wayland do not have that leverage.
      (Tizen will use wayland, but do not know if they choose weston or roll their own solution, and have no idea what requirements there will be for gpu drivers there, nor if Tizen Wayland implementation will be license-compatible with Weston).

      So if Weston folks will wont use API's developed for Mir, than we also gain Wayland on proprietary blobs faster.

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      • #18
        Suddenly, people like Mir. 8)

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        • #19
          Good thing

          The recent Mir announcement makes it a bit more urgent that we put our weight behind Wayland and help it reach its full potential.
          And they are aiming at spring 2014! Does that mean that if Mir wasn't announced there wouldn't be a usable Wayland display server one year from now? I really do understand why Canonnical couldn't keep on waiting for it to ship.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by MartinN View Post
            It gave such a nice kick in the ass to everyone who was working on Wayland , out of complacency and into action.

            Thank you Mark et al! If that was your plan all along, that's just pure genius!
            That is not true at all.

            Canonical said they'd use Wayland. They decided otherwise but never bothered to tell anyone until way later. We have been assuming they'd do their share of the work needed to use Wayland. Now that Canonical finally made public that they are not going to do their share, we're stepping up.

            Mir is speeding up nothing. Canonical should've made their decision known to GNOME, even if just privately. Now we have been doing work, but still thought they'd do most of it.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by MadsRH View Post
              And they are aiming at spring 2014! Does that mean that if Mir wasn't announced there wouldn't be a usable Wayland display server one year from now? I really do understand why Canonnical couldn't keep on waiting for it to ship.
              Actually we're aiming for September 2013 for a beta release, April 2014 = stable. Though probably a more conservative distribution will maybe wait a little bit more before they change.

              If max 2.000 people at GNOME cannot find any bugs anymore, that does not mean it'll be stable when used by a huge distribution. 1000x the users = discovery of way more bugs. So September 2013 something initial, April 2014 I expect a distribution like Fedora to help out with testing, but conservative distributions probably wait a bit longer (openSUSE, Debian).

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              • #22
                Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
                If KDE pulls the same stunt
                They already stated that their will be no official support as long as Ubuntu is the only distribution that uses Mir (no distro specific patches).
                and Canonical does nothing about it
                What should they do, aim a gun at the developers heads?
                and tries to force me to use Unity
                What should they do, aim a gun at your head?
                than it looks like I'll be on 12.04 for a long time to come
                The only logical conclusion: I don't like the decisions they make, so I stay with them instead of changing to something that supports my aims. /irony

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by MadsRH View Post
                  And they are aiming at spring 2014! Does that mean that if Mir wasn't announced there wouldn't be a usable Wayland display server one year from now? I really do understand why Canonnical couldn't keep on waiting for it to ship.
                  Really?

                  This Mir "project" just shows that Cannonical and/or the engineers working for them seem to be incapable to communicate and collaborate with other projects... you know, the things that make open source great in the first place. Hell, it looks like they can't even communicate to their users/community, downgrading them to consumers.

                  What if they would have talked to Wayland devs and contributed to it? You might be running Wayland right now instead of sometime next year.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by BO$$ View Post
                    X.org is and has always been my friend.
                    Both Gnome and KDE plan to support both Wayland and X.org in their future releases (in both toolkits and compositors).

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                    • #25
                      great news lokking forward to see gnome

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Vim_User View Post
                        The only logical conclusion: I don't like the decisions they make, so I stay with them instead of changing to something that supports my aims. /irony
                        You expect people to be logical on Phoronix???

                        This is the biggest tinfoil hat wearing group I know!

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by nightmarex View Post
                          See Mir is a good thing, we should have Wayland adoption in no time now =).
                          I was thinking the same thing. Unity Desktop exists partially due to the Gnome team's very odd design choices. Maybe Mir will motivate them to make more Gnome usable and less mousable; give us back all those features they removed.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by zerothis View Post
                            I was thinking the same thing. Unity Desktop exists partially due to the Gnome team's very odd design choices. Maybe Mir will motivate them to make more Gnome usable and less mousable; give us back all those features they removed.
                            That's odd, because Canonical did the same thing with Unity: Developed it internally, never communicated.

                            We had a design hackfest where Canonical did their own meetings.

                            So interesting that you seem to have more knowledge about this... care to cite your references?

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                            • #29
                              Canonical wants Ubuntu OS. They want a product that will stand apart from the sea of Linux distros in the eyes of the consumer. They are doing a fine job of distancing themselves from the rest of the pack so far.

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                              • #30
                                Regardless of whether you prefer wayland or mir, both are currently lacking a certain amount of what some would call essential functionality in comparison to X. Off the top of my head:
                                - Multi-GPU support
                                - Hybrid laptop (PowerXpress, Optimus) support
                                - modeswitching API
                                - multi-display API
                                These are obviously not insurmountable, but still a lot of work. Just something to keep in mind.

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