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Moving On From An X.Org World To Wayland

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  • #31
    Originally posted by frign View Post
    I am not completely into the Wayland-spec, but I am certain this is part of it. How did the devs put it? Every frame is perfect, and judging from my tests with GL-applications (like glgears), this works well.
    Yes ever frame is perfect because they control whats in the buffers. If theres something wrong in the buffers then they (or the graphics drivers) fucked up. All Wayland does is take pointers and buffers and display their contents. How they got there, and whats in them (but not WHO put what in there, wayland keeps close tabs on buffer security) doessnt matter to the protocol.

    And X is complex because they wanted it to be as platform independent as possible, they were writing an operating system ONTOP OF an existing operating system (whatever flavor of unix you ran) That complexity is a bad thing. Wayland has the right idea: the parts that can never break (Wayland) have to be minimal so that one mistake doesnt impact a trillion other things. Wayland is made to get out of the way and anything "complex" (such as multiple GPU's) is "A client problem."

    If we ever hit a big changeup in the way we do graphics (Optimus) again in the future, it will help to ensure that the protocol isn't the problem. With X + Optimus the protocol WAS, and to an extent IS, the problem. Because instead of cluttering up the protocol we just introduce new libraries, new clients, and they handle the changes. All Wayland wants is pointers and buffers and a display to shove their contents onto.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Ericg View Post
      Yes ever frame is perfect because they control whats in the buffers. If theres something wrong in the buffers then they (or the graphics drivers) fucked up. All Wayland does is take pointers and buffers and display their contents. How they got there, and whats in them (but not WHO put what in there, wayland keeps close tabs on buffer security) doessnt matter to the protocol.

      And X is complex because they wanted it to be as platform independent as possible, they were writing an operating system ONTOP OF an existing operating system (whatever flavor of unix you ran) That complexity is a bad thing. Wayland has the right idea: the parts that can never break (Wayland) have to be minimal so that one mistake doesnt impact a trillion other things. Wayland is made to get out of the way and anything "complex" (such as multiple GPU's) is "A client problem."

      If we ever hit a big changeup in the way we do graphics (Optimus) again in the future, it will help to ensure that the protocol isn't the problem. With X + Optimus the protocol WAS, and to an extent IS, the problem. Because instead of cluttering up the protocol we just introduce new libraries, new clients, and they handle the changes. All Wayland wants is pointers and buffers and a display to shove their contents onto.
      Not to forget the many radical changes in-kernel which required lots of reworking in X.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by kitsune View Post
        Have no problem at playing this in Firefox...
        What ancient/buggy video plug-in you use?
        He hasn't enabled Gstreamer while building :P

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Thaodan View Post
          He hasn't enabled Gstreamer while building :P
          Gstreamer?
          Triplet of mplayer/gnome-mplayer/gecko-mediaplayer don't need Gstreamer ;P

          Anyway, if object/buffers from client would be 24bit pixel data + 8bit alpha channel, then subpixel client side rendering of fonts shouldn't be a problem for compositor.
          Right?

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          • #35
            Originally posted by kitsune View Post
            Gstreamer?
            Triplet of mplayer/gnome-mplayer/gecko-mediaplayer don't need Gstreamer ;P

            Anyway, if object/buffers from client would be 24bit pixel data + 8bit alpha channel, then subpixel client side rendering of fonts shouldn't be a problem for compositor.
            Right?
            To enable video suppport without plugins you must build --with-gstreamer

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            • #36
              I thought theora and vp8 were native in FF? Has that changed?

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              • #37
                Wayland is part of X.org. Wayland developers are X.org developers as well.
                http://lwn.net/Articles/539620/

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by finalzone View Post
                  Wayland is part of X.org. Wayland developers are X.org developers as well.
                  http://lwn.net/Articles/539620/
                  X.org is both an organization (X.org Foundation) and a software project (X.org server). Wayland is developed by the folks at X.org, but is a very different piece of software than X.org. The software release is what people are talking about, not the organization, as the organization really doesn't do anything.

                  It's similar to how Apache refers both to the Apache Software Foundation and the Apache HTTPD Server, depending on context.

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