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Running Wayland: It Works, But A Lot Of Work Remains

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  • #31
    Originally posted by elanthis View Post
    I dunno. I'd be afraid he'd remember my relationship with Google halfway through and grind his teeth right through my junk. Then throw a chair at me.
    but you like it rough...?

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    • #32
      Originally posted by johnc View Post
      It'll likely be similar to the current disaster we have when trying to play id Software games with PulseAudio.
      ...and now you just said another magical word...PulseAudio...let's just not transform this thread in another discussion about it

      I only will say that PA is one of the reasons i prefer Slacware to UBUNTU_and_derivates....it's not polluted with that....thing

      In Slackware, i play all Linux games w/o Video or Audio problems including the ones from iD...
      Last edited by AJSB; 08-11-2012, 02:15 PM.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by AJSB View Post
        ...and now you just said another magical word...PulseAudio...let's just not transform this thread in another discussion about it
        Yet you personally just did that. You can remove PulseAudio on any distribution if you so desire.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Teho View Post
          Yet you personally just did that. You can remove PulseAudio on any distribution if you so desire.
          That could be jusr fine and dandy but it's not like that...to solve audio problems in ETQW i had to remove PulseAudio....ETQW is just fine now.

          But then i installed WET and no audio at ALL...i searched i try every trick....no solution.

          BUt if i try to use both games in Slackware (no PA c**p) everything just works....and don't need to try any trick to make it so (except the old one of changing to 44khz in WET menu).

          As soon as Slackware 14.0 is out, i will get rid of this CRAPUNTU thing....

          When Steam Client is out, it will or not work in Slackware , then we will see.


          What really bothers me in Wayland thing is that i have a felling that it will be another can of worms like PA or worse.
          Last edited by AJSB; 08-11-2012, 04:24 PM.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by AJSB View Post
            That could be jusr fine and dandy but it's not like that...to solve audio problems in ETQW i had to remove PulseAudio....ETQW is just fine now.

            But then i installed WET and no audio at ALL...i searched i try every trick....no solution.

            BUt if i try to use both games in Slackware (no PA c**p) everything just works....and don't need to try any trick to make it so (except the old one of changing to 44khz in WET menu).

            As soon as Slackware 14.0 is out, i will get rid of this CRAPUNTU thing....

            When Steam Client is out, it will or not work in Slackware , then we will see.


            What really bothers me in Wayland thing is that i have a felling that it will be another can of worms like PA or worse.
            I get the feeling that the majority people against the modern "techs" implemented in Linux (PA, WL, systemd) are a buch of weird neckbeards that use odd WMs with half the functionality of a proper DE and do everything through a terminal thinking this makes them 1337.

            FFS the world moves forward.

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            • #36
              Sigh... I hate this community..

              First the "it's going to be forced down my throat! SOMEONE WILL COME TO MY HOUSE AND MAKE ME INSTALL IT AT GUNPOINT!" troll(s).

              Then the people commenting how crappy the screenshots look as if it was some sort of prepared PR techdemo or some shit,
              and not a voluntarily put together liveOS which most WL developers aren't affiliated with anyway.

              And then finally PulseAudio? Again? For the last time: It's been distributed by distros in a premature state
              just like KDE 4, but that was a good thing after all because how else would they've discovered
              all the bugs in ALSA causing mayhem? Can't fix software without testing it..

              Sometimes I wish Larabel wouldn't cover Wayland at all and just let it brew until it's pretty much finished,
              so that people would realize Xorg isn't just going to be discontinued all of a sudden as soon as Wayland is ready.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
                I get the feeling that the majority people against the modern "techs" implemented in Linux (PA, WL, systemd) are a buch of weird neckbeards that use odd WMs with half the functionality of a proper DE and do everything through a terminal thinking this makes them 1337.

                FFS the world moves forward.
                ++

                On some thread on The H someone actually even called D-Bus "bloated shit that gets forced down our throats"...

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
                  I get the feeling that the majority people against the modern "techs" implemented in Linux (PA, WL, systemd) are a buch of weird neckbeards that use odd WMs with half the functionality of a proper DE and do everything through a terminal thinking this makes them 1337.

                  FFS the world moves forward.
                  Well, FWIW, i have nothing against systemd , as for my WM, i use XFCE so it's not that odd , is it ?
                  As for the terminal thing, yeah, i do some stuff there, but i prefer not to do....then again, i'm not afraid to do so.
                  (It's also funny that you mention the Terminal because many times users have to resort to the Terminal to solve PA issues)


                  The problem with PA and WL is that if those devs joined instead X and ALSA they might just have contributed to solve the problems of those w/o breaking anything, but NOOOO, they just love to reinvent the wheel .

                  Guess what ? a wheel is a wheel and it only works well if it's round not if it's square

                  Yes, the World moves forward....but forward is not always the best direction...using a gamer terminology, sometimes it's best to strafe
                  Last edited by AJSB; 08-11-2012, 05:01 PM.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by AJSB View Post
                    There you go !!!! S**T all over

                    Imagine that if some "old" games make X calls....if xWayland is discontinued ( and IT WILL BE DISCONTINUED) those games won't run

                    So, i'm supposed to do what if i still like, like many do, play those games ?!? Use WINE to play their Windows versions ?!?
                    No. XWayland will actually live on a little longer than the standalone X server (like you know X today) will.

                    Why? Because not all software will ever be ported away from X; either because there is no source, or because no-one wants to put in the effort, and some of that software will stay useful.

                    And even the standalone X will take decades to die. Really, X is not disappearing anywhere in any such timeframe you could possibly care.


                    Btw. the wheel has been invented again a lot of times: wooden cart wheel, air-inflated rubber wheel, bicycle wheel, all the different car wheels... and for very good reasons. Try to drive a modern car with 100-year-old wooden cart wheels.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by AJSB View Post
                      The problem with PA and WL is that if those devs joined instead X and ALSA they might just have contributed to solve the problems of those w/o breaking anything, but NOOOO, they just love to reinvent the wheel .:rolleyes
                      You simply have no idea what you are talking about. Many of the Wayland developers are also X.org developers including its founder. PulseAudio is the de facto audio mixer for Linux and it's developed together with ALSA developers because you know, PulseAudio runs on top of ALSA.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Teho View Post
                        You simply have no idea what you are talking about. Many of the Wayland developers are also X.org developers including its founder. PulseAudio is the de facto audio mixer for Linux and it's developed together with ALSA developers because you know, PulseAudio runs on top of ALSA.
                        No, actually i know of what i'm talking about....i might haven't express myself well because English is not my natural language.
                        I knew perfectly that PA works on top of ALSA...

                        "many of" is not the same as "all of them"....and my point fits as well to them....if they kept their efforts all to the X and ALSA projects , we might haven't these issues....

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by pq__ View Post
                          No. XWayland will actually live on a little longer than the standalone X server (like you know X today) will.

                          Why? Because not all software will ever be ported away from X; either because there is no source, or because no-one wants to put in the effort, and some of that software will stay useful.

                          And even the standalone X will take decades to die. Really, X is not disappearing anywhere in any such timeframe you could possibly care.


                          Btw. the wheel has been invented again a lot of times: wooden cart wheel, air-inflated rubber wheel, bicycle wheel, all the different car wheels... and for very good reasons. Try to drive a modern car with 100-year-old wooden cart wheels.
                          I doubt that will take decades to X go away...UBUNTU will drop it at 1st chance and that will affect lot's of other distros based on it....

                          ...and no, to make a wheel of a different material doesn't count as reinventing it...it's still circular nut square/octagonal/whatever

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Teho View Post
                            Yet you personally just did that. You can remove PulseAudio on any distribution if you so desire.
                            In binary distros, no you can't, without recompiling everything that depends on it.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Ancurio View Post
                              On some thread on The H someone actually even called D-Bus "bloated shit that gets forced down our throats"...
                              What an apt description. Whoever said that is a gentleman and a scholar.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by AJSB View Post
                                I doubt that will take decades to X go away...UBUNTU will drop it at 1st chance and that will affect lot's of other distros based on it....

                                ...and no, to make a wheel of a different material doesn't count as reinventing it...it's still circular nut square/octagonal/whatever
                                For the mainstream distributions might be the case but there are people (or organizations) who need to run weird/complex apps that only work on X and those people usually pay to get support and keep things running. And of course don't underestimate the average weirdbeird who hates change.

                                Its not going away as soon as some might think.

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