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Open-Source Doom 3 Running On Wayland

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  • Open-Source Doom 3 Running On Wayland

    Phoronix: Open-Source Doom 3 Running On Wayland

    The dhewm3 engine, which is one of the open-source forks of the id Tech 4 engine similar to ioDoom3, is now working on Wayland...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTE0NzI

  • #2
    Nice to see it running.

    Anyone have the hardware specs that was running on for comparison? I'd mostly like to know if there's a cost/benefit of running this game on Wayland vs. over X.

    Also, the end of the video highlights why mouse capture support is a requirement for gaming

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Veerappan View Post
      Anyone have the hardware specs that was running on for comparison? I'd mostly like to know if there's a cost/benefit of running this game on Wayland vs. over X.
      Well, that was captured with weston running on x11 because I ran into an issue with weston straight on drm. On top of that, the capture process slowed the game down a little.
      So no real numbers to compare yet. Once I cleanup and push my wayland patches for SDL2 you're welcome to try yourself.

      Originally posted by Veerappan View Post
      Also, the end of the video highlights why mouse capture support is a requirement for gaming
      Indeed, and in fact I posted this video in #wayland for that reason, because such a mouse grab is currently not implemented in wayland.

      Comment


      • #4
        Awesome

        I love this video.
        It strengthens my hope that soon we can get rid of old X.
        X did its contribution to linux, but linux needs to move on to the next level.
        I know replacing X with Wayland brings its own challenges, but It also makes the development much easier, both for driver and desktop developers (Gtk, Qt, etc).
        X is way too complex that slows down progression.
        Also it's time for canonical to step in and contribute to wayland instead of just watching it. If they don't they are stupid!
        Beleieve me or not canonical has the power to make wayland a mainstream topic. Only after that companies like Nvidia and AMD start to take it seriously.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by sepisoad View Post
          I love this video.
          It strengthens my hope that soon we can get rid of old X.
          X did its contribution to linux, but linux needs to move on to the next level.
          I know replacing X with Wayland brings its own challenges, but It also makes the development much easier, both for driver and desktop developers (Gtk, Qt, etc).
          X is way too complex that slows down progression.
          Also it's time for canonical to step in and contribute to wayland instead of just watching it. If they don't they are stupid!
          Beleieve me or not canonical has the power to make wayland a mainstream topic. Only after that companies like Nvidia and AMD start to take it seriously.
          Canonical contributes and plans to implement wayland in one of the next releases. Some apps (ie firefox) seem not to care so much about it but there is still plenty of time.

          Comment


          • #6
            Compared to the original DOOM 3, the changes of dhewm 3 worth mentioning are:
            • 64bit port
            • SDL for low level OS support, OpenGL and input handling
            • OpenAL for audio output, all OS specific audio backends are gone
            • OpenAL EFX for EAX reverb effects (read: EAX on all platforms)
            • A portable build system based on CMake
            • (Cross-)compilation with mingw-w64
            https://github.com/dhewm/dhewm3

            That is basically everything I wanted from a Doom 3 source port. Can not wait until it is stable.

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            • #7
              I bow to your magnificent coding 5|<1llz! Fantastic work!

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              • #8
                As Shuttleworth already stated he plans to take Ubuntu proprietary some where down the road I hope they stay out of it all together.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by jvillain View Post
                  As Shuttleworth already stated he plans to take Ubuntu proprietary some where down the road I hope they stay out of it all together.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jvillain View Post
                    As Shuttleworth already stated he plans to take Ubuntu proprietary some where down the road I hope they stay out of it all together.
                    Sauce of that comment as that's taking it out on a limb

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by chmmr View Post
                      Representing Ubuntu, he was actually one of the first of all distros to express an explicit support for Wayland. He wrote the following in November 2010:
                      http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/551

                      The next major transition for Unity will be to deliver it on Wayland, the OpenGL-based display management system. Wed like to embrace Wayland early, as much of the work were doing on uTouch and other input systems will be relevant for Wayland and its an area we can make a useful contribution to the project.

                      Were confident well be able to retain the ability to run X applications in a compatibility mode, so this is not a transition that needs to reset the world of desktop free software. Nor is it a transition everyone needs to make at the same time: for the same reason well keep investing in the 2D experience on Ubuntu despite also believing that Unity, with all its GL dependencies, is the best interface for the desktop. Well help GNOME and KDE with the transition, theres no reason for them not to be there on day one either.

                      Timeframes are difficult. Im sure we could deliver *something* in six months, but I think a year is more realistic for the first images that will be widely useful in our community. Id love to be proven conservative on that :-) but I suspect its more likely to err the other way. It might take four or more years to really move the ecosystem. Progress on Wayland itself is sufficient for me to be confident that no other initiative could outrun it, especially if we deliver things like Unity and uTouch with it. And also if we make an early public statement in support of the project. Which this is!

                      In coming to this view, several scenarios were considered.

                      One is the continued improvement of X, which is a more vibrant project these days than it once was. X will be around a long time, hence the importance of our confidence levels on the idea of a compatibility environment. But we dont believe X is setup to deliver the user experience we want, with super-smooth graphics and effects. I understand that its *possible* to get amazing results with X, but its extremely hard, and isnt going to get easier. Some of the core goals of X make it harder to achieve these user experiences on X than on native GL, were choosing to prioritize the quality of experience over those original values, like network transparency.

                      We considered the Android compositing environment. Its great for Android, but we felt it would be more difficult to bring the whole free software stack along with us if we pursued that direction.

                      We considered and spoke with several proprietary options, on the basis that they might be persuaded to open source their work for a new push, and we evaluated the cost of building a new display manager, informed by the lessons learned in Wayland. We came to the conclusion that any such effort would only create a hard split in the world which wasnt worth the cost of having done it. There are issues with Wayland, but they seem to be solvable, wed rather be part of solving them than chasing a better alternative. So Wayland it is.

                      In general, this will all be fine actually *great* for folks who have good open source drivers for their graphics hardware. Wayland depends on things they are all moving to support: kernel modesetting, gem buffers and so on. The requirement of EGL is new but consistent with industry standards from Khronos both GLES and GL will be supported. Wed like to hear from vendors for whom this would be problematic, but hope it provides yet another (and perhaps definitive) motive to move to open source drivers for all Linux work.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by bug! View Post
                        Representing Ubuntu, he was actually one of the first of all distros to express an explicit support for Wayland. He wrote the following in November 2010:
                        http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/551
                        I was asking for a citation for the claim that Canonical/Shuttleworth "plans to take Ubuntu proprietary some where down the road". Nothing in that post suggests that... if that's what you were implying.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jvillain View Post
                          As Shuttleworth already stated he plans to take Ubuntu proprietary some where down the road I hope they stay out of it all together.
                          That's a bunch of FUD from you:

                          http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-...our-philosophy

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by asdx
                            Hopefully we're going to see the compositors being ported now that the protocol is set in stone with the 0.95.0 release, I think Wayland/Weston 1.0 is coming soon also, and that's where the protocol is supposed to be 100% frozen/stable and we should start seeing more applications and compositors working natively on Wayland from there.

                            I think it's already amazing that Wayland/Weston can run on a stock Linux 3.x kernel with open-source graphics drivers, and that xwayland already exists, and the fact that most X11 applications work on Wayland/Weston, I mean, Wayland/Weston hasn't even reached 1.0 yet and it already does all this, I think Wayland/Weston has come a long way and it's amazing, I think it's going to be even more amazing once it reaches 1.0 and becomes the default windowing system in Linux and most distros.
                            Just remember, that "frozen" does not mean "complete". Wayland 1.0 will lack in the protocol for anyone trying to support a full DE (or games, like you saw with that Doom 3 video). 1.0 only means, that the protocol existing so far is not going to be broken.

                            Also, 1.0 does not mean it can become a default windowing system in desktop distros. It means, that toolkit, DE, and application developers can now start serious work on supporting Wayland without playing continuous catch-up with protocol changes.

                            It is all exciting, yes, but distro migration to Wayland will be a long path. And when it's done right, you probably can't even see the difference, unless you know what to look for.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by asdx
                              Once Firefox finishes their port to GTK+3 it shouldn't be too hard to make it work on Wayland natively I believe.

                              But it seems like they haven't finished the port to GTK+3 yet.

                              https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=627699

                              It's a good thing however that xwayland exists and that X11/GTK+ apps such as Firefox already work via xwayland. I think that we'll need to run some apps (such as Firefox) for a while via xwayland until they become native applications on Wayland, but it's a good thing that xwayland already provides this sort of backward compatibility for "legacy" applications.

                              I think the most important thing right now is to get the compositors to work in Wayland natively (i.e. kwin, mutter, compiz, etc) and then the whole DEs like KDE, GNOME, etc. So that users can already use Wayland instead of X for our WMs and DEs, and so that distros can already ship Wayland by default. Once we have the DEs working natively on Wayland we can use xwayland to run the usual applications such as Firefox, until they become native Wayland applications.

                              I think the progression to Wayland is going to be gradual, perhaps some applications will take longer to port, but since there is xwayland this shouldn't be a problem.

                              Hopefully we're going to see the compositors being ported now that the protocol is set in stone with the 0.95.0 release, I think Wayland/Weston 1.0 is coming soon also, and that's where the protocol is supposed to be 100% frozen/stable and we should start seeing more applications and compositors working natively on Wayland from there.

                              I think it's already amazing that Wayland/Weston can run on a stock Linux 3.x kernel with open-source graphics drivers, and that xwayland already exists, and the fact that most X11 applications work on Wayland/Weston, I mean, Wayland/Weston hasn't even reached 1.0 yet and it already does all this, I think Wayland/Weston has come a long way and it's amazing, I think it's going to be even more amazing once it reaches 1.0 and becomes the default windowing system in Linux and most distros.

                              Wayland is amazing and a much needed change for Linux. Kudos to the Wayland developers.
                              Libre Office is not running yet, Blender i think is not running and quite few more of the "big ones"

                              On the DE front only enlightenment implemented client decorations but i have no idea if it can currently run as a whole desktop.

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