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There's A Direct3D 9.0 Gallium3D State Tracker

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  • #16
    I feel a little sorry for zhasha (the author). He spends a few days messing with a little D3D9 state tracker for his own personal learning, then happens to mention it in a forum and suddenly it's a news post and he's being insulted for various reasons. Leave him alone, if he wants to spend some time with a pet project then that's his choice.

    That said, we don't know the state of Linux graphics in 2-3 years time. If at that point the open source drivers are to comparable to the proprietary offerings then the Wine devs may just switch to using a G3D D3D state tracker as the primary D3D path. If no one writes a D3D state tracker we'll never know.

    For now, this changes nothing for anyone because it's just a personal project.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by zhasha View Post
      Can't I have a little fun while learning the G3D interface without it ending up on the Phoronix articles page?
      Michael's got himself subscribed to so many RSS feeds that he probably gets notification every time Linus sneezes, so it's not necessarily surprising that he'd catch wind of something like this.

      That being said, I think it's a great idea. Even if you don't complete significant portions of the D3D 9.0 implementation, hopefully someone does in the future, because I think it would be very useful to have. I wouldn't be surprised if VMWare was working on something like this at the moment.

      Currently, to the best of my memory, VirtualBox is linking against Wine in order to get D3D working in Windows guests running on Linux hosts. The existence of a D3D state tracker for gallium could lead to some nice performance boosts (and possibly compatibility boosts as well) for people who want to run Windows games in a VM on Linux. I like Wine, but they've always had compatibility issues with newer games, and this could help resolve a lot of those issues.

      I wish you luck on this. At a minimum, it will help you learn the Gallium3D interface, which is something I've been wanting to do for a while now. If a D3D state tracker ends up in Mesa because of this, great, but I won't grab a torch/pitchfork if it doesn't work out.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by NSLW View Post
        Maybe they would give two shits about it if developer of this tracker would show something useful and reliable.
        Not a chance. Wine has spent years on getting Direct3D to a feature-for-feature and bug-for-bug compatibility with Windows. Throwing that all away and starting over will take the same amount of years to get back to the current state.

        Now, I can see the usefulness of this state tracker as just another graphics API a Unix developer can make use of. I don't know, maybe it could be nice for porting Windows applications. At the very least it shows the expressive power of Gallium3D.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Veerappan View Post
          Michael's got himself subscribed to so many RSS feeds that he probably gets notification every time Linus sneezes, so it's not necessarily surprising that he'd catch wind of something like this.
          Well in all fairness, if people don't want stuff like this to be repeated and spread around then don't use the net, keep it local and keep the mouth shut.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by deanjo View Post
            Well in all fairness, if people don't want stuff like this to be repeated and spread around then don't use the net, keep it local and keep the mouth shut.
            I don't mind it being spread around the internet, but I do very much mind it being blown completely out of proportion.

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            • #21
              I wish all the best luck on this project, and other possible D3D10+ projects for Gallium, since IMO these APIs are much more elegant to program on, and since I want my projects to be as cross-platform as possible, this would be a really nice thing to have.

              That said, I understand this is a personal project only, but I must confess I wish it grows into a successfull project.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by thefirstm View Post
                Just wondering, Why in the world would you want to write a DX9 application for Linux? Why not use OpenGL, which is much, much, much more widely supported?
                DirectX is not comparable to OpenGL. You meant Direct3D and there are several good reasons why D3D would be nice to have in a cross-platform fashion (not going to happen, so just saying). In short, D3D has evolved faster and now provides a superior API to OpenGL.

                @mdias: my feelings exactly.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by zhasha View Post
                  I don't mind it being spread around the internet, but I do very much mind it being blown completely out of proportion.
                  That's like asking a person to never eat. Without rumors, speculation, exaggeration there is no internet.

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                  • #24
                    Actually, not that anybody cares, but I discussed this with a few Wine devs a while ago. The main concensus was that Wine needs to continue to support binary GLX stacks, so they can't discard their GL backend, and putting effort into Gallium would divide their time.

                    Also, like myself, zhasha isn't paid for fd.o work. Cut him some slack. He's allowed to do what he wants. When I get bored, I come on here and flame you guys; when he gets bored, apparently he writes Dx state trackers. It's all good.

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                    • #25
                      My hope is that this ends up allowing VirtualBox guests to support Aero Glass for the Windows 6 releases. If running on a Windows host, it would call into native Direct3D 9, or if running on Linux, it would call into a Direct3D 9 state tracker. The Sun devs are already working on a WDDM driver for the VirtualBox "graphics adapter."

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by zhasha View Post
                        this is not a project meant to deliver significant results but merely a hello world state tracker in the only API I saw fit to try my mind on. I chose D3D9 because it's well documented on the MSDN and is tied to a class inheritance OOP model, making it easier (for me at least) to implement.
                        Apologies.
                        The article seems to have blown the project out of proportion, at least in the way it read to me. I was under the impression that there was another major move to adapt-to-MS. Now it just looks like you're playing with it for fun and probably a good way to "get into" g3d development.

                        Maybe the phoronix guys should try to categorize their so-called "news" in terms of relevance.

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                        • #27
                          That was a close call; this almost turned into a repeat of "Wayland: A New X Server For Linux".

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                          • #28
                            Does it actually mean that Direct3D calls can be run untranslated on GPUs in Linux?

                            How can it be possible at all?

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by birdie View Post
                              Does it actually mean that Direct3D calls can be run untranslated on GPUs in Linux?

                              How can it be possible at all?
                              The same way it's possible on Windows?

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by thefirstm View Post
                                Just wondering, Why in the world would you want to write a DX9 application for Linux? Why not use OpenGL, which is much, much, much more widely supported?
                                For two reasons

                                * All good demos (scene.org) are made for DX, and some even release the source code, so porting those to Linux would be much easier, if the DX would just could be untouched.

                                * If someone want to learn DX, but don't want to use Windows =)

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