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Mesa 7.4 Released, Fixes The 7.3 Bugs

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  • #16
    Are you sure that tearing is an effect of the monitor ?
    I thought it had to see with changing the front buffer while updating the screen. I didn't activate V-Sync (I should start looking for it).

    Whatever, it has always been this way with the radeon driver on my laptop. Usually, you can barely see it but it is quite visible with glxgears. I guess it is because it is not really accelerated (look at the poor FPS rate, and a core of my CPU is fully used).

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    • #17
      When you add a compositor into the mix, you can get tearing at the compositor level as well and that *does* show up in screen shots.

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      • #18
        Didn't think of that.

        So in other words, we're screwed double

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        • #19
          Originally posted by RealNC View Post
          So in other words, we're screwed double
          Only temporarily -- I'm sure that's a great comfort

          MacOS and Vista were designed around a compositor, while X/DRI has a variety of compositors which can be inserted in what is fundamentally a non-composited stack. There probably needs to be a standard way to handle buffer queues all the way from app through compositor to screen so that :

          (a) only completed images get composited,

          (b) only completed frames from the compositor get displayed on the screen,

          (c) screen updates are synchronized with vblank, and

          (d) fixed-rate apps like video playback can either double or drop frames as needed to stay in sync with the display refresh, and games can reliably cap at display refresh rate.

          Working the other way - genlocking the display refresh rate to the video frame rate -- sounds attractive but is tough to implement reliably.

          Krh's work on Wayland is a good example of "designing around a compositor from day one". Whether the future is something like Wayland or just knowledge and ideas from Wayland going back into the current graphics stack, that's what it's going to take.

          The good news is that a lot of this can probably be hacked into the current stack (the current tear-free code in radeon/radeonhd is essentially an innovative hack), it just won't work all the time or in all configurations.
          Last edited by bridgman; 03-28-2009, 10:10 AM.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by bridgman View Post
            Only temporarily -- I'm sure that's a great comfort

            MacOS and Vista were designed around a compositor, while X/DRI has a variety of compositors which can be inserted in a non-composited stack. I don't think the changes required will be huge, but there needs to be a standard way to handle buffer queues from app to compositor and compositor to screen so that only completed images get composited, only completed frames from the compositor get displayed on the screen, screen updates are synchronized with vblank, and fixed-rate apps like video playback can either double or drop frames as needed to stay in sync with the display refresh, or that the display refresh can be synchronized to the video frame rate.

            Krh's work on Wayland is a good example of "designing around a compositor from day one". Whether the future is something like Wayland or just knowledge and ideas from Wayland going back into the current graphics stack, that's what it's going to take.

            The good news is that a lot of this can probably be hacked into the current stack (the current tear-free code in radeon/radeonhd is essentially an innovative hack), it just won't work all the time or in all configurations.
            Thanks for the explanation. Wayland is surely a good project, I can't wait to find an Intel GPU to try it out.

            Do you think GEM will be the perfect way to pass buffers from the compositor to the driver ? It would be faster than copying each frame (it is a supposition). I think it is the way Wayland implements everything.

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            • #21
              Anyone know what the chances are that this makes its way into Ubuntu Jaunty?

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              • #22
                I think the chance is very low, because Jaunty gets released in less then a month. Not enough time for testing etc. Also Jaunty is already frozen, so no new packages without exception.
                I hope for 9.10

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by bugmenot View Post
                  I think the chance is very low, because Jaunty gets released in less then a month. Not enough time for testing etc. Also Jaunty is already frozen, so no new packages without exception.
                  I hope for 9.10
                  Don't hope for 9.10. Instead, hope for Mesa 7.5/7.6

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by MPF View Post
                    Are you sure that tearing is an effect of the monitor ?
                    I thought it had to see with changing the front buffer while updating the screen. I didn't activate V-Sync (I should start looking for it).

                    Whatever, it has always been this way with the radeon driver on my laptop. Usually, you can barely see it but it is quite visible with glxgears. I guess it is because it is not really accelerated (look at the poor FPS rate, and a core of my CPU is fully used).
                    I got same effect when running glxgears using mesa software renderer over ssh.
                    Last edited by suokko; 03-28-2009, 05:51 PM.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by suokko View Post
                      I got same effect when running glxgears using mesa software renderer over ssh.
                      Yep, that's understandable.

                      The fact is that it IS hardware accelerated, my CPU usage is really really low even when playing videos.
                      That's why I asked the question, it did this when I installed the XServer 1.6.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by MPF View Post
                        Have you filled a bug on http://bugs.freedesktop.org ?

                        I'm sorry, I can't try it out because I can't play with my XPress 200M (I can barely play on TeeWorlds in window mode in 640*480).
                        I posted it on nabble:

                        http://www.nabble.com/Dynamic-ligthi...d22754754.html

                        someone with R400 (X700) have dynamic lighting regression too in q3a.

                        I think none distro will include plain mesa-7.4, it has so many regression...


                        Last edited by dungeon; 03-29-2009, 01:48 AM.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by bugmenot View Post
                          I think the chance is very low, because Jaunty gets released in less then a month. Not enough time for testing etc. Also Jaunty is already frozen, so no new packages without exception.
                          I hope for 9.10
                          I thought 7.4 was the stable release of 7.3 and as such will be bugfixes only, no new features? If that's the case, it seems reasonable to assume it'll make it's way into Jaunty eventually.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by chaos386 View Post
                            I thought 7.4 was the stable release of 7.3 and as such will be bugfixes only, no new features? If that's the case, it seems reasonable to assume it'll make it's way into Jaunty eventually.
                            Well, I did not think at that by now. You could be right

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                            • #29
                              Either 7.4, or 7.3 with a lot of of fixes applied

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by MPF View Post
                                Have you filled a bug on http://bugs.freedesktop.org ?

                                I'm sorry, I can't try it out because I can't play with my XPress 200M (I can barely play on TeeWorlds in window mode in 640*480).
                                Both these bugs in mesa core are now fixed by Roland Scheidegger (bug #20965, #20966)

                                Fixed in master (ebc1478e501d43e0de54e7b6c3edfbc81d7d20c6) and mesa_7_4_branch (7be149cfd131c0b3f7d4337bb83e6fba5f563bf9)

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