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  • #16
    Originally posted by agd5f View Post
    Nvidia supports their hw via their closed source driver. AMD supports our hw via both closed source and open source drivers. You can use the closed source drivers in the interim while open source driver support progresses. How are nvidia or AMD any different in this regard other than the fact that AMD actually supports open source?
    Yes you are right. I can wipe my machine and reinstall an older OS and hope I didn't lose any thing then spend weeks getting it all configured the way I want it again and I would have to go back to listening to the graphics card run at full bore again running up my power bill because of the older kernel and I can't ever upgrade for fear of breaking the video drivers etc, etc. But then patching and security aren't really all that important are they? Just seems natural that you would let the graphics card dictate what OS you run don't you think?

    Now back to the real world. Going forward any Intel based mobo's I buy will have integrated graphics and I will just disable it if I feel a need to down grade to a separate video card. I have stuck with AMD mobos, procs and graphics because they at least used to make an effort to support Linux. But that support really seems to be diminishing. Seriously publishing the register to twiddle to turn on audio over hdmi is so proprietary that it needs to be locked away in a safe some where? Really? You get a lot more sympathy from me over cutting edge graphics stuff because that at least has the potential to give some info away. But for the love of Pete the on off switch for audio over hdmi as a critical trade secret? Come on. That's just insulting to the people that buy the hardware.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by jvillain View Post
      Yes you are right. I can wipe my machine and reinstall an older OS and hope I didn't lose any thing then spend weeks getting it all configured the way I want it again and I would have to go back to listening to the graphics card run at full bore again running up my power bill because of the older kernel and I can't ever upgrade for fear of breaking the video drivers etc, etc. But then patching and security aren't really all that important are they? Just seems natural that you would let the graphics card dictate what OS you run don't you think?
      ?? The topic was newly introduced GPUs, specifically SI, not older GPUs moved to a legacy branch.

      Now back to the real world. Going forward any Intel based mobo's I buy will have integrated graphics and I will just disable it if I feel a need to down grade to a separate video card. I have stuck with AMD mobos, procs and graphics because they at least used to make an effort to support Linux. But that support really seems to be diminishing.
      Diminishing ? Why would you say that ?

      I could understand "my expectations are constantly increasing and your support is not growing quite as fast as my expectations", but not "diminishing".

      Seriously publishing the register to twiddle to turn on audio over hdmi is so proprietary that it needs to be locked away in a safe some where? Really?
      No, not really. Not even true. We published the registers. What we weren't able to do despite months of trying was publish the finished code.

      You get a lot more sympathy from me over cutting edge graphics stuff because that at least has the potential to give some info away. But for the love of Pete the on off switch for audio over hdmi as a critical trade secret? Come on. That's just insulting to the people that buy the hardware.
      You might want to look at the code. It's not an on/off switch, not even close.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by bridgman View Post
        Knights Corner doesn't have graphics drivers, does it ?
        The point is that Knight's Corner (evolved Larrabee) is the closest equivalent to a discrete Intel GPU, despite not being an actual GPU. The fact Intel open-sources the sw for it is quite encouraging for the argument that "given a hypothetical Intel discrete GPU, they would open-source the driver".

        There, the same point, just written in three times the words. Clear enough?

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        • #19
          Originally posted by agd5f View Post
          Nvidia supports their hw via their closed source driver. AMD supports our hw via both closed source and open source drivers. You can use the closed source drivers in the interim while open source driver support progresses. How are nvidia or AMD any different in this regard other than the fact that AMD actually supports open source?
          Exactly. The AMD Open Source driver does not yet support SI, and may not for months or years, while the binary driver is an unusable PoS. Well done.

          Don't try to tell me the Blob is usable, last time I tried it, that was sometime last year, it did not support gnome 3 for 4 months straight after release and crashed when I started xbmc. Unfortunately the OSS driver did not support hdmi audio back then so I was basically screwed on my htpc -> back to windows. Not to mention that xvba just does not play back some videos it does fine in windows.

          EDIT: Don't take that as mindless amd bashing please. It comes from long and painful experience from myself and also colleagues who also work in IT. One of my colleagues started his linux htpc with an AMD gpu and gave it up after 3 months and bought nvidia, which more or less worked out of the box for him.

          EDIT: corrected NI to SI
          Last edited by barkas; 06-29-2012, 04:58 PM.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by barkas View Post
            Exactly. The AMD Open Source driver does not yet support NI, and may not for months or years.
            ?? NI support has been there for a year or more. Trinity support has been out for a few months and that's based on NI.

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            • #21
              That's like concluding we will support UVD in the open drivers because we support most of the other blocks. Reasonable if you don't look too closely.

              But very clear

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              • #22
                Originally posted by bridgman View Post
                ?? NI support has been there for a year or more. Trinity support has been out for a few months and that's based on NI.
                Sorry, I meant SI.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by barkas View Post
                  it did not support gnome 3 for 4 months straight after release
                  Not AMD fault, but AMD add workaround to driver anyway.
                  Originally posted by barkas View Post
                  crashed when I started xbmc
                  Where we may look at XBMC crashlog and core dump?
                  Originally posted by barkas View Post
                  Not to mention that xvba just does not play back some videos it does fine in windows.
                  That was changed.

                  Anything else?

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                  • #24
                    Well as long as fglrx runs you can use the aticonfig command to enable h264 l5.1. but xbmc fernet menta branch is currently everything else than stable - especially when you dont use it fullscreen only but windowed or when you switch between both ways using \. do you try xbmc fm git code often?

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                    • #25
                      I find it curious that the AMD people imply they have some inside info on Intel's discrete efforts. What makes you think the hypothetical GPU would not be open, or that Knight's Corner will not have the rest open-sourced too once it actually starts selling a bit?

                      If you're referring to the currently not-perfect GCC support for it, I find it likely that will change in the future.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by bridgman View Post
                        ?? The topic was newly introduced GPUs, specifically SI, not older GPUs moved to a legacy branch.
                        That is what I am referring to. My HD7xxx based card. When my HD4xxx card failed I needed to upgrade. Now with a brand new card with less power than my old GForce3 not because of the hardware but the drivers. The blob might be the greatest thing ever on RedHat5. Not sure. But it is useless on FC18. Sure AMD doesn't want to support some thing so bleeding edge and I don't blame them. But no one is asking them to. What people are asking for is documentation. With out it the HD7xxx is just one step up from a software frame buffer device. I don't understand why the AMD people are shocked that Linux people might not want to pay $$$ for bleeding edge features they are never going to get to use. Actually most things like audio over hdmi isn't exactly bleeding edge any more. Releasing documentation should have been of the process of coming to market, not an after thought.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by curaga View Post
                          I find it curious that the AMD people imply they have some inside info on Intel's discrete efforts. What makes you think the hypothetical GPU would not be open, or that Knight's Corner will not have the rest open-sourced too once it actually starts selling a bit?

                          If you're referring to the currently not-perfect GCC support for it, I find it likely that will change in the future.
                          As I recall, Intel was asked whether Larrabee graphics drivers would be open sourced, and they refused to answer.

                          That's not to say they wouldn't have been, but it's completely fair to note that when people are on here claiming that they would have.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by RussianNeuroMancer View Post
                            Not AMD fault, but AMD add workaround to driver anyway.Where we may look at XBMC crashlog and core dump?That was changed.

                            Anything else?
                            Everything about this answer is wrong. Especially the attitude.

                            It IS AMDs fault if it is the only driver that does not work in gnome3.

                            I don't have that crashdump anymore, it's been a while since then, but I do not doubt that you can still get it to crash if you try.

                            Yeah it was maybe changed, ignoring the fact that VDPAU worked fine out of the box and we're still struggling with xvba and that you have to do some very badly documented things and use some very bleeding edge software to get it to work.
                            Last edited by barkas; 07-01-2012, 05:01 AM.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by barkas View Post
                              It IS AMDs fault if it is the only driver that does not work in gnome3.
                              Do you read comment 14 of this bugreport carefully?
                              Originally posted by barkas View Post
                              ignoring the fact that VDPAU worked fine out of the box
                              No, I doesn't. I just said "That was changed".
                              Originally posted by barkas View Post
                              and we're still struggling with xvba and that you have to do some very badly documented things and use some very bleeding edge software to get it to work
                              This is also going to change. When XBMC-XvBA Team patches will be accepted by upstream ffmpeg, any ffmpeg-based application will be capable of using XvBA.
                              HWUVD_H264Level51Support probably require wide testing before going to be enabled by default.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by barkas View Post
                                It IS AMDs fault if it is the only driver that does not work in gnome3.
                                Seriously? What kind of logic is this?
                                So lets imagine you're the only one in your family who doesn't do drugs, you're automatically the one doing it wrong!?

                                lol...

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