Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

AMD RadeonSI HD 7000 Gallium3D Still Being Raised

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • AMD RadeonSI HD 7000 Gallium3D Still Being Raised

    Phoronix: AMD RadeonSI HD 7000 Gallium3D Still Being Raised

    While the Radeon HD 7000 "Southern Islands" series is nearly six-months old, the open-source support for these new "GCN" graphics cards remains largely unusable...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTEwMzM

  • #2
    Yep, this is really annoying. I wish GPU makers would flat-out stop making huge architectural changes to their graphics architecture every release (or every few releases). We're to a point now where a GPU is basically just a massively parallel general purpose CPU, whose only material distinction from an actual CPU is that it sacrifices per-core serial performance for higher massively parallel performance. That, and the relatively higher latency between submitting a job and getting the result. As far as the programming model, I don't think it needs to change.

    The industry really did need this distinction between "fast serial performance" and "fast parallel performance"; now we've got it -- CPU, GPU. Done deal, right? Stop reinventing the wheel and just make the parts smaller and smaller, and maybe toss in incremental changes which are no more disruptive than what HD6xxx did. Let's stick to an architecture like GCN for at least a decade and just keep rolling. The open drivers will be able to stabilize in that time, which is neat.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by allquixotic View Post
      Yep, this is really annoying. I wish GPU makers would flat-out stop making huge architectural changes to their graphics architecture every release (or every few releases). We're to a point now where a GPU is basically just a massively parallel general purpose CPU, whose only material distinction from an actual CPU is that it sacrifices per-core serial performance for higher massively parallel performance. That, and the relatively higher latency between submitting a job and getting the result. As far as the programming model, I don't think it needs to change.

      The industry really did need this distinction between "fast serial performance" and "fast parallel performance"; now we've got it -- CPU, GPU. Done deal, right? Stop reinventing the wheel and just make the parts smaller and smaller, and maybe toss in incremental changes which are no more disruptive than what HD6xxx did. Let's stick to an architecture like GCN for at least a decade and just keep rolling. The open drivers will be able to stabilize in that time, which is neat.
      R600g driver supports hardware since HD2xxx . Almost a decade now...

      Comment


      • #4
        Does fglrx runs error free/proper with linux? No. (like gnome shell)
        Do AMD have proper r600g driver with key features, like Power Management, UVC ? No...

        Means, AMD just produce cards just for Windows. Not for Linux.
        They have all half working drivers on linux and sum of them doesn't equal one...

        Comment


        • #5
          DeathKnight, your post applies to 99% of all hardware produced today.

          Actually, that's probably 100%.

          What AMD are doing right is working transparently (documentation) and working with the community. GPUs are probably the most difficult hardware to write complete and performant drivers for.

          Comment


          • #6
            IIRC it took ~8 months for evergreen. You can't expect support to arrive faster than that when major architectural changes are involved, even though they started working on it sooner.

            If anyone's bought one of these things without informing themselves about linux support, then it's their own fault for being disappointed. There was no "supported on linux"-sticker on the box, was there?


            Originally posted by Death Knight View Post
            Means, AMD just produce cards just for Windows. Not for Linux.
            Which may be related to the fact that almost all of their GPUs are bought by windows users. And that most of their actual customers, the companies producing the cards (AMD only produces the GPUs), don't care about linux support and neither advertise nor support it.

            The cards that are specifically produced for linux are called FireGL. Did you get one of those? Did you actually help pay the disproportionate costs of supporting an OS with ~2% market share? No? Then you get what you pay for, what was advertised on the box: a card that runs well on windows.

            Comment


            • #7
              How come?

              How come the open source Radeon drivers suck even though AMD provide documentation?
              While the open source Nouveau drivers are better even though Nvidia doesn't help anything at all.

              Or am I wrong?

              Comment


              • #8
                well i don't think is "slowly" michael considering is a brand new architecture which has no previous reference design or drivers and i kindly remind you that mesa is getting many changes in parallel these days which have many devs busy (namely Clover, MSAA, default GL3, LLVM shaders, Contexts, hiZ, and many performance patches still out of tree) cuz they need to reach an usable stable before the master git get branched.

                beside GCN gived many headaches to windows driver team too, namely crappy texture quality, corssfire regressions, poor scaling in some games, etc. a new architecture is never easy so give our community guys some slack they will get there and i bet once mesa master get branched GCN will receive lot of love

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by uid313 View Post
                  How come the open source Radeon drivers suck even though AMD provide documentation?
                  Who says they suck? They are missing some features (on new hardware only) and still need some optimisations, but most people using them are very happy.

                  While the open source Nouveau drivers are better even though Nvidia doesn't help anything at all.
                  Who says nouveau is better than radeon drivers? You might be alone with that opinion.

                  N.B. I appreciate the effort of nouveau developers.

                  Anyway, 3 guys wrote 100,000 lines of code in a few months and it's still not a fully-featured driver after being available to the community for a month. What a scandal!
                  Last edited by pingufunkybeat; 05-15-2012, 10:21 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    But FireGL is not a graphic card, its a odd workbench product for spesific odd jobs!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by uid313 View Post
                      How come the open source Radeon drivers suck even though AMD provide documentation?
                      While the open source Nouveau drivers are better even though Nvidia doesn't help anything at all.

                      Or am I wrong?
                      1.) GPU drivers are extremely difficult to program an analogy could be "wifi driver == Lego Plane || GPU driver == build a combat ready F35 using only chopsticks and glue"
                      2.) AMD VLIW architecture requires that you optimize stuff in the driver || nVidia before kepler do most at hardware level so is somehow a bit easier
                      3.) you have C++11 API documentation, what is stopping you in writing a kernel using advanced C++ techniques and objects?? you have the API documentation LOL are you shy?? documentation analogy
                      4.) AMD documentation is about GPU ASM/registers API NOT OpenGL X.x for GPU newbies, so no it doesn't tell you how to blend 2 YUV formatted texture attached to an model in a 3ds file at 850FPS LOL in the same sense that the CPU ASM API don't tell you how to write Libreoffice. Dont trust me go and download AMD docs (i expect someone post after read this "LOL AMD sucks it only give ASM docs, WTF??? they hate linux OMG") <-- i will laugh like crazy

                      5.) Have you tried to run you GCN card in FreeBSD? it won't work right? cuz BSD graphic subsytem is LOL and ancient right? well that was linux graphic stack genius, so ppl arent only writing drivers PPL the problem is they are writing the entire graphic subsystem alongside the drivers at the same time, which is even harder to do.

                      Microsoft did this too from old XP model to the new V/7 model and it took them 10 years to get it almost right

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        from where I sit the open source AMD drivers work just fine.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Very helpfull thread I may say...................

                          Now I just recently purchased a Gigabyte radeon HD7870, I brierfly tried it out to see that it worked, then put it away. The reason for getting the card at this time is that in the past by the time the OS driver stabiises one usually cannot get the card so if one waits for the driver to stabilse you miss out. I have been using Linux now for twenty years, back in the early days of the graphics drivers it took something like two to three years to produce something usable. Now with the cards way way more complex this time is now getting below a year, Well done all concerned. Open Source for ever!!!

                          Note: I have 4 systems (using debian), three of them Radeon cards (5870, 4870 and a 3870 all using the OS driver) the 4th using an Nvidia GTX 560.using the closed src driver, very happy with all systems. I found the OS radeon driver just works no hassles.

                          The system with the Nvidia is used for 3D development work, programming a simulator, the OS radeon driver (in debian anway) at this stage not up to the task.

                          Blacksmith
                          Last edited by Blacksmith; 05-16-2012, 06:16 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Blacksmith View Post
                            The reason for getting the card at this time is that in the past by the time the OS driver stabiises one usually cannot get the card so if one waits for the driver to stabilse you miss out.
                            :-( this is a complete shame

                            in a consumer point of view this is a complete disaster.

                            maybe used cards from ebay help ?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              @Blacksmith

                              Do you use debian squeeze (maybe with backports) or wheezy or sid?

                              fglrx was already removed from wheezy, it is still in sid. But: sid has xserver 1.12 so fglrx 12-4 would not work. So you could downgrade to wheezy (pin to 1001 or more, then d-u) and use fglrx 12-4 with it. It is just a matter of time till wheezy will get xserver 1.12 and fglrx is impossible - or is there a magical update in the pipe that nobody knows of?

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X