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  • #31
    Originally posted by crazycheese View Post
    Just.
    Dont.
    Buy.
    Proprietary.
    At all.


    If you see the alternative.
    You mean this?

    http://wiki.opengraphics.org/tiki-index.php

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by locovaca View Post
      An "alternative" generally implies something that actually is available and offers comparable features.

      That project still has yet to release an actual consumer-oriented usable product, and their graphics engine is basically something that's barely capable of low-speed OpenGL 1.x. Calling that an "alternative" to any product offered in the last 10 years (literally, one decade) from the likes the AMD, NVIDIA, Intel, or so on is just silly. You might as well call "begging for a cure from God" to be an alternative to a routine appendectomy for someone dieing from appendicitis.

      You might be able to accelerate RENDER on that hardware (if it exists as anything other than a ridiculously expensive FPGA board), but then RENDER is an 11 year old spec that predates the release of programmable GPUs, which are pretty much mandatory for any modern acceleration (even on basic 2D desktops). If all you have is a basic triangle rasterizer you might as well just dump the hardware acceleration entity and do everything in software on the CPU's SIMD engine; you'd get better performance.

      Comment


      • #33
        i hope that at some point we'll see a third company challenging nVidia and ATI in the desktop/workstation sector (and hopefully even more foss friendly than ATI)

        there isn't enough competition in that segment i think

        except if CPUs become so fast/advanced (ie APU) that we wont need dedicated GPUs any more

        Comment


        • #34
          The HD8xxx/9xxx might mark the beginning end of the traditional desktop computer.

          Tablets with wireless keyboards will take over. So I hope future Fusion CPUs will be acounted for as well. I might not ever buy a desktop computer again (maybe one).

          And if you don't believe me then considder the following;
          iPad 2 will get Adobe Photoshop. It has an HDMI cable plug available. It has iWork, video editing, music making and even X-Plane 9!

          There is also the jMonkeyEngine working on Android. It is a full featured allround game engine (MIT license), completely written in Java 1.6 with multithreading and shader based. In notime you can make a real commercial grade game with it.

          The desktop _will_ die and I just know that the HD9xxx will propably be the last (if any) GPU I might still buy. This is also the very end of Microsoft Windows and the era of extreme calculation power chips that require fans for cooling.

          Comment


          • #35
            doubt that the desktop PC will die soon

            you still need a big screen (except if we move to something like projecting glasses) for some tasks and you still need a powerfull processor for things like rendering engineering and similar applications.

            but who knows

            time will tell

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
              doubt that the desktop PC will die soon

              you still need a big screen (except if we move to something like projecting glasses) for some tasks and you still need a powerfull processor for things like rendering engineering and similar applications.

              but who knows

              time will tell
              Sure there are HDMI ports on some smartphones and tablets. Others already feature a screen over WiFi thing, but I'm not sure how that works. The iPad is compatible with the Apple wireless keyboard an the new Mac OS X doesn't have traditional scroll bars anymore; you scroll with the trackpad (also available for the iMac). It also features an App store and the aiOS homescreen for launching them.

              There is ofcourse a battle to be faught on the server side and ARM knows it; they are already developping ARM server cluster chips.

              Sure there are still _workstations needed_, but that's a niche market.

              Given the keyboard and monitor support in these tablets, coupled with the upcomming 32core ARM CPU's with shader based full hd OpenGL ES 2.0 and DirectX (I'm not kidding you; google it), this is it.

              Given that KDE js already prepairing for this and Qt is touch era proof; we might get somewhat new Mac OS X-y desktops.

              Check Apple.com for the details of the upcomming Mac OS X for developpers for proof

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
                The HD8xxx/9xxx might mark the beginning end of the traditional desktop computer.

                Tablets with wireless keyboards will take over. So I hope future Fusion CPUs will be acounted for as well. I might not ever buy a desktop computer again (maybe one).
                We've heard that many times before, trust me.

                At the end of the day, there's no substitute for a 20"+ screen and a pointing device that doesn't require half the screen to be covered by your hand.

                There may well be some devices someday that deprecate the need for a desktop or a proper notebook computer, but little handheld devices are not them. Even if they had all the power of a desktop PC, the sheer limitations of the medium of touch and small screens puts a very real limit on what exactly such devices are useful for.

                Remember, tablets are in no way new. That the iPad has made them hip again is irrelevant. Apple's MacBook sales have only gone up since the iPad came out.

                And if you don't believe me then considder the following;
                iPad 2 will get Adobe Photoshop. It has an HDMI cable plug available. It has iWork, video editing, music making and even X-Plane 9!
                And it can then be used for a lot of trivial, low-level, amateur-level stuff. People who want to do real photo editing work sure as shit aren't going to do it on an iPad or similar device.

                There is also the jMonkeyEngine working on Android. It is a full featured allround game engine (MIT license), completely written in Java 1.6 with multithreading and shader based. In notime you can make a real commercial grade game with it.
                Except actually, you can't. JME is just one in a very large sea of little hobbyist game engines that is nowhere close to professional grade. You can make goofy little $4 Android games in it, sure. You can't make Dead Space 2 in it, not to

                Comment


                • #38
                  You come home and throw it in a docking station station and you're done. Problem solved.

                  And all the techniques in Dead Space are provided by jME3 alpha 4. Cinematics, walking paths, bullit physics, camera types, multithreading, shaders, lightning, UI building, scene files and editing, nodes, geometry calculations (vector), particles... What exactly am I missing?

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Even if we solve the computing power "problem" the problem with the tablet is the user interaction IMO. Not when you want to do simple stuff (browse, mail etc) but in more demanding "work" tasks ie write code or text thats more than a few characters long, design a 3d object or whatever. Those are fine if you can connect to a monitor or a keyboard but on the move its going to be a bit tricky.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Do keep in mind that HD9xxx is probably released three years from now (2014) and that a desktop will last 5-6years (2019-2020) so there is a lot to be conquered and figured out in 8-9 years.

                      Also setting up office in a café takes no longer than placing your 13" tablet on the table along with a wireless keyboard (those Apple keyboards are not large!) en you're up and running.

                      Do you realy carry around a 19" laptop to model on the go? o_O

                      Also a case with a build in keyboard can turn it into a laptop any time you want (I've already seen them in real life)

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
                        Do keep in mind that HD9xxx is probably released three years from now (2014) and that a desktop will last 5-6years (2019-2020) so there is a lot to be conquered and figured out in 8-9 years.

                        Also setting up office in a café takes no longer than placing your 13" tablet on the table along with a wireless keyboard (those Apple keyboards are not large!) en you're up and running.

                        Do you realy carry around a 19" laptop to model on the go? o_O

                        Also a case with a build in keyboard can turn it into a laptop any time you want (I've already seen them in real life)
                        A 13" tablet + wireless keyboard = a laptop by another name. Once you add a keyboard then you add a mouse, because taking both hands off the keyboard to grab the screen and move something around gets tedious and slow. And then you're looking for an OS that favors using a mouse, and we're right back to where we started.

                        I recall the same predictions for PDAs in the early 2000s and that they were going to kill the Notebook market for business travelers entirely. Pull the PDA out of your pocket, take the Stoaway Keyboard out and dock the two. A laptop replacement the size of two wallets. It was a great idea, except that it did not overcome the actual need of a laptop.

                        If you're going to carry around a 13" Tablet + Wireless Keyboard/Mouse, what's the point, just go for a 13" laptop which is all the more powerful, gets just as good battery life, and doesn't suffer from the clumsiness that comes with such a configuration.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          I don't know where to start so I'll just sum it up:
                          -You don't need a laptop configuration but you can;
                          -Doing office on my smartphone is a disaster;
                          -Doing iWork office on an iPad is bliss;
                          -Screensize is big;
                          -Batterylife rocks on tablets;
                          -No stupid fan holes;
                          -It makes zero noise;
                          -There is no charger with thesize of a brig;
                          -It's lighter;
                          -You can keep that keyboard in your backpack and use the damn thing;
                          -iPad sales in 9months > all sales of all tablets ever;
                          -Everybody can learn to work on an iPad in a day Vs. figuring out how desktops work even after ten years.

                          So... you tell me why this is failing...

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
                            I don't know where to start so I'll just sum it up:
                            -You don't need a laptop configuration but you can;
                            -Doing office on my smartphone is a disaster;
                            -Doing iWork office on an iPad is bliss;
                            -Screensize is big;
                            -Batterylife rocks on tablets;
                            -No stupid fan holes;
                            -It makes zero noise;
                            -There is no charger with thesize of a brig;
                            -It's lighter;
                            -You can keep that keyboard in your backpack and use the damn thing;
                            -iPad sales in 9months > all sales of all tablets ever;
                            -Everybody can learn to work on an iPad in a day Vs. figuring out how desktops work even after ten years.

                            So... you tell me why this is failing...
                            1. My 13" C2D gets 8 hours battery life.
                            2. It makes 0 noise because it's not a 45 Watt desktop processor.
                            3. The battery charger is not a "brick", it reasonably sized.
                            4. It has proper functionality for the creation, storage, and manipulation of any document format I can throw at it.
                            5. The difference between 3 pounds and ~1.5 pounds is much bigger on paper than it is in real life.
                            6. It is not locked to any sort of monarchical company to decide what's best for it. IT Admins aren't too big on that sort of thing. Even Windows, for all of its annoying behaviors with things like auto updates, allows a large amount of configuration to be changed at the Group Policy level.

                            The iPad may be the in thing now, but like very other technological hit it will run its course and fade away. Netbooks hit all of your non-tablet based criteria, and know why those quickly went away? People tried to get them to do more and more things, realized their limitations at said things, and all of a sudden they weren't sexy any longer. The same will happen to the iPad. While a minority of the population says "How can I change my habits to suit the iPad?", the business world says "How can I get the iPad to do what I'm doing today." And that's where it will fail.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              OK, fair enough, but:
                              -You can't hold your laptop on your lap;
                              -You still need to lift you hand of the trackpad/mouse to type;
                              -We are talking about a 'new' product (tablets were still just a traditional desktop OS+touchscreen)
                              -Way too expensive for what they could offer that was widely available (Vaio)
                              -People still don't get it with desktops (where's the blue e?! My internet is broken!!!)
                              -The iPad doesn't have any real competetion which is good (people can't install more demanding app X) so they can set the bar for what is possible.
                              -Still a few years to go to put a core i9000 in it.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
                                OK, fair enough, but:
                                -You can't hold your laptop on your lap;
                                I can't see a compelling business case for this. For casual usage, sure, it's nice. For doing any sort of serious work sitting down with it on my lap slows me down.

                                -You still need to lift your hand of the trackpad/mouse to type;
                                If you're using a keyboard the mouse is physically closer for quick switching and only requires one hand. Using a keyboard with a tablet, which is presumably propped up on a desk, requires a longer reach and two hands, one to stabilize the tablet and one to gesture (or both to gesture).

                                -We are talking about a 'new' product (tablets were still just a traditional desktop OS+touchscreen)
                                The iPad is not a new product. It's the evolution of the PDA. PDA + Cell Phone = Smart Phone. Smart Phone + MP3 Player = iPhone. iPhone + Large Screen = iPad. The constant factor in all of this, from the PDA to the iPad, is that the device is meant to supplement, not replace a full size desktop. Companies typically only issue one device per employee.

                                -Way too expensive for what they could offer that was widely available (Vaio)
                                -People still don't get it with desktops (where's the blue e?! My internet is broken!!!)
                                Actually, in my experience, people in the 30-50 year range are just starting to get near universal acceptance of the Microsoft Office Suite and web browsers. I think you are exaggerating here.

                                -The iPad doesn't have any real competition which is good (people can't install more demanding app X) so they can set the bar for what is possible.
                                -Still a few years to go to put a core i9000 in it.
                                Actually, I consider the lack of competition to be bad in just about any area, and the iPad is no exception. As a companion to a standard desktop it is overpriced. Get the base price down to $200 and then we're talking. Competition will bring that price down. Android 3.0 might do that, if device makers can put out some decent devices at the price points they have been doing with the first/second waves of Android tablets.

                                I'm not saying the iPad isn't a good device or that it's not wildly successful in certain markets. But the exponential growth seen with the iPad is just not sustainable and will level out once the secondary pc/tablet market saturates.

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