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Nvidia blames nvidia for driver cheating in H.A.W.X. 2

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  • Nvidia blames nvidia for driver cheating in H.A.W.X. 2

    http://www.gamestar.de/hardware/news...md_nvidia.html


    nvidia points out that reduce visual quality for speed is cheating and nvidia is so right cheating is bad yes nvidia is a true company nvidia means cheating by nvidia is bad sure.. sure!

    bad nvidia

  • #2
    The bad and the ugly*
    .. and there is no good.


    * support in linux. Really looking forward for opensource driver kick nvidia blob backplate, btw.

    Comment


    • #3
      http://www.kitguru.net/components/gr...g-allegations/

      Shame on nvidia for fixing an application bug in their drivers. Shame on them. Troll fail = Qaridarium.

      Hi Everybody,
      What is being experienced is not an “Antialiasing cheat” but rather a HawX bug that is fixed by our driver using an application specific profile.
      In a nutshell, the HawX application requests the highest possible AA “sample quality” at a particular AA level from our driver. Without our driver fix, the game would be running 16xCSAA instead of standard 4xAA when you select 4xAA in-game. It runs the proper 4xAA with the driver fix. You defeat the fix by changing the .exe name, causing it to run at 16xCSAA.
      You may remember that Geforce 8800 introduced Coverage Sampling AA (CSAA) technology, which added higher quality AA using little extra storage. Prior to 8800 GTX and CSAA, there was only one “sample quality level” for each AA level, so if an application requested four AA samples, the hardware performed standard 4xAA. However, with 8800 GTX GPUs onwards, our drivers expose additional sample quality levels for various standard AA levels which correspond to our CSAA modes at a given standard AA level.
      The “sample quality level” feature was the outcome of discussions with Microsoft and game developers. It allowed CSAA to be exposed in the current DirectX framework without major changes. Game developers would be able to take advantage of CSAA with minor tweaks in their code.
      Unfortunately, HawX requests the highest quality level for 4xAA, but does not give the user the explicit ability to set CSAA levels in their control panel. Without the driver profile fix, 16xCSAA is applied instead of standard 4xAA. Recall that 16xCSAA uses 4 color/Z samples like 4xAA, but also adds 12 coverage samples. (You can read more about CSAA in our GeForce 8800 Tech Briefs on our Website).
      When you rename the HawX.exe to something else, the driver profile bits are ignored, and 16xCSAA is used. Thus the modest performance slowdown and higher quality AA as shown in the images.
      To use “standard” 4xAA in a renamed HawX executable, you should select any level of anti-aliasing in the game, then go into the NVIDIA Control Panel and set 4xAA for “Antialiasing Setting” and turn on “Enhance the application setting” for the “Antialiasing mode”.
      Nick Stam, NVIDIA

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by deanjo View Post
        http://www.kitguru.net/components/gr...g-allegations/

        Shame on nvidia for fixing an application bug in their drivers. Shame on them. Troll fail = Qaridarium.
        "16xCSAA" if an app wana have 16xCSAA then the only true solution is give them the 16xCSAA !

        and this is a "nvidia it means to played" game means nvidia payes for that bug !

        they only wana be sure amd cards run on "16xCSAA" and nvidia cards run on 4xaa

        its just not an bugfix force 4X by driver!

        its a cheat nothing more.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
          "16xCSAA" if an app wana have 16xCSAA then the only true solution is give them the 16xCSAA !

          and this is a "nvidia it means to played" game means nvidia payes for that bug !

          they only wana be sure amd cards run on "16xCSAA" and nvidia cards run on 4xaa

          its just not an bugfix force 4X by driver!

          its a cheat nothing more.
          LMFAO, you really have no clue. The apps 4x setting requests the highest available instead of the true 4x AA mode. That's not a cheat. It would be the same if the the app says 1920x1200 but instead of requesting 1920x1200 it requests the highest resolution of the monitor which could be 2560x1600. The driver bug fix is there to just give what the app is requesting. That's not cheating, that's proper development.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by deanjo View Post
            LMFAO, you really have no clue. The apps 4x setting requests the highest available instead of the true 4x AA mode. That's not a cheat. It would be the same if the the app says 1920x1200 but instead of requesting 1920x1200 it requests the highest resolution of the monitor which could be 2560x1600. The driver bug fix is there to just give what the app is requesting. That's not cheating, that's proper development.
            in nvidia words: "the HawX application requests the highest possible AA “sample quality” "

            means nvidia cheats by not giving the app the highest possible AA

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
              in nvidia words: "the HawX application requests the highest possible AA “sample quality” "

              means nvidia cheats by not giving the app the highest possible AA
              LMFAO, the menu setting says 4x AA, not the highest, the drivers are simply giving what the menu says. In other words, they are giving EXACTLY what is requested by the user instead of going off and doing it's own thing. Again that isn't cheating at all.

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              • #8
                Cheating would be requesting 4x AA and then the drivers providing only 2x AA.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                  LMFAO, the menu setting says 4x AA, not the highest, the drivers are simply giving what the menu says. In other words, they are giving EXACTLY what is requested by the user instead of going off and doing it's own thing. Again that isn't cheating at all.
                  the dev of the app define what kind of aa they wana have and not the 'menu'

                  means if the dev write 4xaa in the menu and write force highest AA in the sourcecode then the highest AA count and not the writing in the menu.

                  nvidia just cheat thats because the dev wana have highest AA and not 4X

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                    Cheating would be requesting 4x AA and then the drivers providing only 2x AA.
                    its just cheating if the dev programm an app and wana have highest AA

                    then 8x-RotatedSample-SuperSampleAA is the true wanted AA and not that nvidia Joke AA

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                      Cheating would be requesting 4x AA and then the drivers providing only 2x AA.
                      nvidia cheat on SSAA to.. they only give you grid-sample SSAA and not the real true Rotated Sample SSAA

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
                        its just cheating if the dev programm an app and wana have highest AA

                        then 8x-RotatedSample-SuperSampleAA is the true wanted AA and not that nvidia Joke AA
                        LMFAO, then the application should show that option. Seriously Q give your head a shake. The true wanted AA mode is the one selected by the user. Only you would consider unexpected behavior caused by not honoring a deliberate end user setting a "cheat". If the same situation was applied to retail for example:

                        You go in to buy a TV at an advertised price. You get the TV but a higher quality one is in the box but lists the same specs but when you get to the till they try to charge you more for the TV without giving a reason. In most countries that is even illegal, it's called "bait and switch".

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                          LMFAO, then the application should show that option. Seriously Q give your head a shake. The true wanted AA mode is the one selected by the user. Only you would consider unexpected behavior caused by not honoring a deliberate end user setting a "cheat". If the same situation was applied to retail for example:

                          You go in to buy a TV at an advertised price. You get the TV but a higher quality one is in the box but lists the same specs but when you get to the till they try to charge you more for the TV without giving a reason. In most countries that is even illegal, it's called "bait and switch".
                          "The true wanted AA mode is the one selected by the user"

                          no the true wanted AA mode is the one selected by the DEV!

                          the user do only use the app and the user belive in the DEV and they wana have what the DEV programms.

                          you think the AA mode selected in the source code is wrong and i tell you only the written text in the app is wrong the source code is right.

                          its a cheat in your definition the DEV force the highest AA mode means in real 8xRSSSAA and nvidia only gives 4xAA out.. thats a cheat!

                          cheat because only the sourcecode care in the software world.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
                            "The true wanted AA mode is the one selected by the user"

                            no the true wanted AA mode is the one selected by the DEV!
                            No it isn't as if it was then it would stipulate that on the bloody menu. It's a case where the dev used one method of requesting what they thought was the correct way to request the mode but the end result wound up requesting something other then what was desired.

                            the user do only use the app and the user belive in the DEV and they wana have what the DEV programms.
                            This has to be the absolute stupidest argument I have read. Speaking as a DEV you are wrong wrong wrong. Having code that pulls in incorrect results is never the wish of any dev.

                            you think the AA mode selected in the source code is wrong and i tell you only the written text in the app is wrong the source code is right.
                            See above comment.

                            its a cheat in your definition the DEV force the highest AA mode means in real 8xRSSSAA and nvidia only gives 4xAA out.. thats a cheat!
                            If my TV is set to 720p and an attached device is set to 720p but it gives 1080i that is not a cheat, that is a bug.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by deanjo View Post
                              No it isn't as if it was then it would stipulate that on the bloody menu. It's a case where the dev used one method of requesting what they thought was the correct way to request the mode but the end result wound up requesting something other then what was desired.
                              This has to be the absolute stupidest argument I have read. Speaking as a DEV you are wrong wrong wrong. Having code that pulls in incorrect results is never the wish of any dev.
                              See above comment.
                              If my TV is set to 720p and an attached device is set to 720p but it gives 1080i that is not a cheat, that is a bug.
                              its so easy to check if its an app bug or an driver cheat.

                              an app bug should only be fixed in the APP sourcecode

                              and not in the nvidia driver thats because fix the so called 'bug' in the app fix that on any GPUs intel,amd,via and not only for nvidia

                              so its easy to check its in the driver then its a cheat! is the bugfix in the app then its not a cheat.

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