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  • #31
    I think the XMir project has many benefits for users that everyone seems to not notice.....

    XWayland: Only applications can run. User must be using DE running natively under Wayland with applications for all non-wayland-native-DE (Xorg apps and pre-wayland gnome2, kde4, E17 apps, ect) can only be run as single applications.

    IE: if your DE of choice hasn't been converted to Wayland native yet, then too bad.

    XMir: DE and applications can run (later application only mode will be supported). User can be running DE running natively under Mir or XMir for all DE's and applications.

    IE: Users have more choices. Use a Mir native DE or not, your choice.


    I see this as a HUGE advantage and great for users to assist with the post-Xorg times transitions that Wayland doesn't support. Its USE NATIVE or too bad with Wayland. There's a choice with Mir/XMir.

    (this user will not debate grammar or the use of the English language)

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Awesomeness View Post
      So they are shutting Kubuntu down and tell their users to switch to a credible alternative?
      Like what?

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by dh04000 View Post
        I think the XMir project has many benefits for users that everyone seems to not notice.....

        XWayland: Only applications can run. User must be using DE running natively under Wayland with applications for all non-wayland-native-DE (Xorg apps and pre-wayland gnome2, kde4, E17 apps, ect) can only be run as single applications.

        IE: if your DE of choice hasn't been converted to Wayland native yet, then too bad.

        XMir: DE and applications can run (later application only mode will be supported). User can be running DE running natively under Mir or XMir for all DE's and applications.

        IE: Users have more choices. Use a Mir native DE or not, your choice.


        I see this as a HUGE advantage and great for users to assist with the post-Xorg times transitions that Wayland doesn't support. Its USE NATIVE or too bad with Wayland. There's a choice with Mir/XMir.

        (this user will not debate grammar or the use of the English language)
        Only one problem with the more choice thing. To have it you need to run (an) Ubuntu (derivative) as no other distro touches Mir/Xmir.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by dh04000 View Post
          I think the XMir project has many benefits for users that everyone seems to not notice.....

          XWayland: Only applications can run. User must be using DE running natively under Wayland with applications for all non-wayland-native-DE (Xorg apps and pre-wayland gnome2, kde4, E17 apps, ect) can only be run as single applications.

          IE: if your DE of choice hasn't been converted to Wayland native yet, then too bad.

          XMir: DE and applications can run (later application only mode will be supported). User can be running DE running natively under Mir or XMir for all DE's and applications.

          IE: Users have more choices. Use a Mir native DE or not, your choice.


          I see this as a HUGE advantage and great for users to assist with the post-Xorg times transitions that Wayland doesn't support. Its USE NATIVE or too bad with Wayland. There's a choice with Mir/XMir.

          (this user will not debate grammar or the use of the English language)

          The same would be possible with XWayland, as soon as the corresponding patches (which XMir builds upon) are used. They are, however, not mainlined, as they are considered unstable.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by verde View Post
            in this case TEARING is fucking everywhere. xMir may help solve those problems (i am not sure if it is possible technicaly. i just guess)
            It does for me, I tested it on my intel machine and there was zero tearing, with compositing on and off in xfwm (compared to xfwm on vanilla X on intel where there's tons of tearing.)

            Comment


            • #36
              I find it both amusing and something akin to a kick in the arse when Ubuntu decided to go ahead with Mir when Steam decided to settle on Ubuntu as the de facto distro for their linux implementation. Steam wanted to get away from the vendor lock-in garbage MS bandy about only to have Ubuntu do a similar thing. At least Mir theoretically should be compatible retroactively.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by oleid View Post
                The same would be possible with XWayland, as soon as the corresponding patches (which XMir builds upon) are used. They are, however, not mainlined, as they are considered unstable.
                Well, it sounds like it would be good for everyone if XMir and XWayland could be cross pollinated and yield both capable or DE and application only modes.

                I'm sure the DE mode patches will be ignored entirely without comment.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by dh04000 View Post
                  I'm sure the DE mode patches will be ignored entirely without comment.
                  We are talking about XWayland DE mode patches, right?

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Xubuntu using Mir instead of Wayland?

                    No thanks, I'll stop using Xubuntu then.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by stqn View Post
                      Not if I disable compositing or use compton. So no its not everywhere.
                      If you have to disable compositing to NOT tear then something is VERY wrong. The main reason to HAVE compositing is to PREVENT tearing.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Pawlerson View Post
                        Like what?
                        I already answered that question: http://phoronix.com/forums/showthrea...870#post348870

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by dh04000 View Post
                          I think the XMir project has many benefits for users that everyone seems to not notice.....

                          XWayland: Only applications can run. User must be using DE running natively under Wayland with applications for all non-wayland-native-DE (Xorg apps and pre-wayland gnome2, kde4, E17 apps, ect) can only be run as single applications.

                          IE: if your DE of choice hasn't been converted to Wayland native yet, then too bad.

                          XMir: DE and applications can run (later application only mode will be supported). User can be running DE running natively under Mir or XMir for all DE's and applications.

                          IE: Users have more choices. Use a Mir native DE or not, your choice.


                          I see this as a HUGE advantage and great for users to assist with the post-Xorg times transitions that Wayland doesn't support. Its USE NATIVE or too bad with Wayland. There's a choice with Mir/XMir.

                          (this user will not debate grammar or the use of the English language)
                          There's nothing preventing XWayland from running a full DE other than the fact that you wouldnt WANT to. If you are running Wayland but EVERYTHING is being shoved through Xwayland...just use X. XWayland is there so specific apps can continue to work, not so that Developers can lie about what display server they are actually running.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by M1kkko View Post
                            I thought XFCE was going with Wayland?
                            IIRC they haven't stated either way. Xfce has issues in regards to the toolkits: their apps at the moment are largely GTK2, and porting everything to GTK3 yields to poorer results (more resources consumed), so they want to stay on GTK2 as long as it's feasible. And GTK2 means Xorg.

                            LXDE, on the other hand, is porting things to Qt, and that means Wayland.

                            Originally posted by dh04000 View Post
                            I think the XMir project has many benefits for users that everyone seems to not notice.....

                            XWayland: Only applications can run. User must be using DE running natively under Wayland with applications for all non-wayland-native-DE (Xorg apps and pre-wayland gnome2, kde4, E17 apps, ect) can only be run as single applications.

                            IE: if your DE of choice hasn't been converted to Wayland native yet, then too bad.

                            XMir: DE and applications can run (later application only mode will be supported). User can be running DE running natively under Mir or XMir for all DE's and applications.

                            IE: Users have more choices. Use a Mir native DE or not, your choice.


                            I see this as a HUGE advantage and great for users to assist with the post-Xorg times transitions that Wayland doesn't support. Its USE NATIVE or too bad with Wayland. There's a choice with Mir/XMir.

                            (this user will not debate grammar or the use of the English language)
                            No. XMir *is* XWayland. The only difference is that Wayland developers realise that running a whole DE on XWayland defeats the purpose of running Wayland to begin with. And Mir developers don't, and advertise running things through XMir, even when there are only disadvantages of doing so.

                            On Wayland, users have more choices as well. Use a Wayland native DE or use Xorg, your choice.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Congrats

                              To the guys saying this is pointless: It's not pointless if Xubuntu wishes to remain a member of the Ubuntu family. And yes, it is funny to see people so upset over this and the Xubuntu team is smaller than the Kubuntu team, yet they still managed to do this. So it can't that difficult to implement.

                              It's just a few Devs afraid of advancement. It's like the old hats telling newbies to use the CLI, it's just wrong if a perfectly usable GUI is available for the new kid. I for one applaud the Xubuntu team. There is no reason to be afraid, it's not like XFCE itself is doing, you can continue using GTK+ and Xorg on some other Distro.

                              TL;DR: Stop being afraid of advancement.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Mike Frett View Post
                                To the guys saying this is pointless: It's not pointless if Xubuntu wishes to remain a member of the Ubuntu family. And yes, it is funny to see people so upset over this and the Xubuntu team is smaller than the Kubuntu team, yet they still managed to do this. So it can't that difficult to implement.

                                It's just a few Devs afraid of advancement. It's like the old hats telling newbies to use the CLI, it's just wrong if a perfectly usable GUI is available for the new kid. I for one applaud the Xubuntu team. There is no reason to be afraid, it's not like XFCE itself is doing, you can continue using GTK+ and Xorg on some other Distro.

                                TL;DR: Stop being afraid of advancement.
                                Please tell me how using a display server within the compatibility module of another display server for all tasks is advancement over just using one display server natively. And of course it's not difficult to implement it's just pointless to do so. If Xubuntu undermines the very reason why people use it, then why even remain a member of the Ubuntu family? Yes, you can use Xfce on another distribution, and that's what I will be recommending if Xubuntu switches to XMir. But the Xubuntu maintainers might as well not bother with it any more, or rebase off Debian, if the suggestion is to use another distribution.

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