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A Note To Canonical: "Don't Piss On Wayland"

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  • Originally posted by ethana2 View Post
    I still hold that if Canonical just went into wayland and submitted 150 patches saying "we want this to be completely different, so we're making it completely different, starting with switching from client-provisioned to server-provisioned canvasses" --you really think that would go over well? What is it you want? You want Canonical to compromise their vision for the future of the desktop? Go fuck yourself. Maybe it'll help you calm down.
    Those are not the only two options and you know it. What we wanted was for them to talk to the Wayland developers when they were taking suggestions on board about crafting the ABI (you know, before they went 1.0) just like all of the other vendors were doing. We are not the ones applying double standards when it comes to Canonical here, they are doing that themselves when compared to to other vendors.

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    • Originally posted by ethana2 View Post
      I still hold that if Canonical just went into wayland and submitted 150 patches saying "we want this to be completely different, so we're making it completely different, starting with switching from client-provisioned to server-provisioned canvasses" --you really think that would go over well? What is it you want? You want Canonical to compromise their vision for the future of the desktop? Go fuck yourself. Maybe it'll help you calm down.
      Everything in Canonical's "vision" is possible in Wayland, much of it without having to change anything in the core in Wayland. Canonical devs would have known this if they had asked. That is the reason they had to backpedal on all of their technical complaints about Wayland, in reality none of them would have been an issue. At most they would have had to maintain their own backend or compositor bits, but that is much less work than maintaining an entire display server and would have caused much less of a rift amongst the Linux community.

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      • I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation

        I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation until I read this discussion thread. Canonical is doing it's own display server, so what? Do you know what "F" in "FLOSS" means?

        Wayland community looks like a very scary place to be. Technical issues and merits can be worked on without having to waste energy on solving social issues and fighting the mafia. I'd pick Mir (or completely new) over Wayland any day in the week. Mir is under an open source licence. Thank you Canonical for contributing to the open source SW pool.

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        • Originally posted by Togga View Post
          I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation until I read this discussion thread. Canonical is doing it's own display server, so what? Do you know what "F" in "FLOSS" means?

          Wayland community looks like a very scary place to be. Technical issues and merits can be worked on without having to waste energy on solving social issues and fighting the mafia. I'd pick Mir (or completely new) over Wayland any day in the week. Mir is under an open source licence. Thank you Canonical for contributing to the open source SW pool.
          Please don't talk if you have absolutely no clue about the matter at hand. Thanks.

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          • Originally posted by Togga View Post
            I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation until I read this discussion thread. Canonical is doing it's own display server, so what?
            I agree. People expressing opinions is exactly like murder, extortion, and racketeering.

            Originally posted by Togga View Post
            Do you know what "F" in "FLOSS" means?
            I know it doesn't mean "no one is allowed to disagree with Canonical".
            Last edited by TheBlackCat; 03-16-2013, 02:30 PM.

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            • Originally posted by Ancurio View Post
              Please don't talk if you have absolutely no clue about the matter at hand. Thanks.
              Thank you for proving my point.

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              • Originally posted by TheBlackCat View Post
                I agree. People expressing opinions is exactly like murder, extortion, and racketeering.


                [10 chars]

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                • Originally posted by Togga View Post
                  I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation until I read this discussion thread. Canonical is doing it's own display server, so what? Do you know what "F" in "FLOSS" means?

                  Wayland community looks like a very scary place to be. Technical issues and merits can be worked on without having to waste energy on solving social issues and fighting the mafia. I'd pick Mir (or completely new) over Wayland any day in the week. Mir is under an open source licence. Thank you Canonical for contributing to the open source SW pool.
                  What a moronic comment....

                  Forums are made for people to discuss things and share their opinions about their topics of interest. So everyone is entitled to his opinion. Only fascists believe that people shouldn't state their opinion on something... Are you one?

                  Btw, the community didn't make and isn't going to make any move against Mir. This doesn't mean that they cannot state their dislike about it...

                  PS: To Canonical: Please recruit more intelligent trolls next time...

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                  • Originally posted by Togga View Post
                    I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation until I read this discussion thread. Canonical is doing it's own display server, so what? Do you know what "F" in "FLOSS" means?

                    Wayland community looks like a very scary place to be. Technical issues and merits can be worked on without having to waste energy on solving social issues and fighting the mafia. I'd pick Mir (or completely new) over Wayland any day in the week. Mir is under an open source licence. Thank you Canonical for contributing to the open source SW pool.
                    Nah, there is no "FLOSS" community at all (FreeBSD and GNU/Linux are pretty distant for instance)

                    At the same time "GNU/Linux" community is actually Red Hat + volunteers while shunning Canonical for being "outside" it is a popular sport.

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                    • Originally posted by TheBlackCat View Post
                      Everything in Canonical's "vision" is possible in Wayland, much of it without having to change anything in the core in Wayland. Canonical devs would have known this if they had asked. That is the reason they had to backpedal on all of their technical complaints about Wayland, in reality none of them would have been an issue. At most they would have had to maintain their own backend or compositor bits, but that is much less work than maintaining an entire display server and would have caused much less of a rift amongst the Linux community.
                      It is Canonical's OS, they know better.

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                      • Originally posted by ворот93 View Post
                        It is Canonical's OS, they know better.
                        This isn't my opinion, they flat-out said they didn't know.

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                        • Originally posted by ворот93 View Post
                          At the same time "GNU/Linux" community is actually Red Hat + volunteers while shunning Canonical for being "outside" it is a popular sport.
                          And now Canonical defenders have switched tactic to give Red Hat more credit than it deserves (I assume to make the larger community seem more insular than it really is). Interesting how the party line has changed over the past few weeks from saying that Canonical was the clear and undisputed Linux leader to now being the rebel...
                          Last edited by Hamish Wilson; 03-16-2013, 05:59 PM.

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                          • Originally posted by e8hffff View Post
                            Nvidia did say they were not going to support Wayland. If support comes then Wayland has a chance, else it's a struggling project.

                            Mir on the other hand will be too tempting for Nvidia to push aside.
                            Other way around. NVIDIA is more tempted to support their contractual installations, which are usually on something like RHEL. If RHEL looks to go the Wayland route, and contract customers look to upgrade, NVIDIA will follow with support. So long as it's merely a consumer tech in more home-user focused distros like Ubuntu, NVIDIA is unlikely interested in Wayland or Mir.

                            Remember, even if they make money, it might not be enough. It's not just making money, it's making a sizable chunk of money compared to other business endeavors. Businesses and divisions that have profits in the millions are regularly shut down because such "small" profits are chump change to some owners and investors, not worth their time. Why spend time managing a group that makes $2,000,000 when other groups your manage make $20,000,000?

                            Home user support on Linux is a charity coming from the workstation contract divisions of NVIDIA. It's not a priority in itself.

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                            • Originally posted by Hamish Wilson View Post
                              And Shuttleworth is? Still, that does not even dispute my point - Gnome Shell had a person in charge of design and ensuring a consistent vision. And it was in fact because of this "leadership" that many seem to have gotten upset about it (for real and imagined reasons). And yet this is exactly what people say they want out of Canonical...
                              I'm not a canonical fan, so I don't know why you'd bring up shuttleworth. My only point was that mccann, the principal behind the design doc and continued driver of the G3 vision, isn't a trained designer.

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                              • Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
                                What a moronic comment....
                                I do not follow this logic. Is this statement using the "community definition" of the word moronic? Reference please.


                                Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
                                Forums are made for people to discuss things and share their opinions about their topics of interest. So everyone is entitled to his opinion. Only fascists believe that people shouldn't state their opinion on something... Are you one?
                                And now strawman arguments on a completely different topic...


                                Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
                                Btw, the community didn't make and isn't going to make any move against Mir.
                                Making this assurance you must be the head of "the community".


                                Originally posted by TemplarGR View Post
                                PS: To Canonical: Please recruit more intelligent trolls next time...
                                Amazing conclusion. Are you looking for job?

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