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Intel Winning Over NVIDIA For Linux Enthusiasts

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  • #31
    Originally posted by bug77 View Post
    Can intel play Oilrush?
    According to their forum the new Intel HD 4000 should be capable of playing OilRush on HD [1280x720] resolution. Altrought they say that the drivers are "problematic".
    BTW the thread on their website was started by me, because I found that game in one gameshop in the UK and wanted to support them. You can found the thread here.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by johnc View Post
      Originally posted by artivision View Post
      Well, Windows and closed source, probably will not exist after 3-5 years. So nvidia must invest on "Socialist/Free".
      You've gotta be kidding me.
      I don't know about closed source in general, but Microsoft is currently struggling in the markets to stay relevant:
      • Mass exodus of developers (Source [PDF])
      • Online search/advertising business makes nothing but losses (Source)
      • Mobile marketshare drops from 13% to 2% between WP7 and WP8 launch
      • Need to give away Office Web Apps for free in order to make users interested in SkyDrive
      • OEMs are upset after Microsoft Surface tablet surprise, $85 license cost for Windows RT makes them uncompetitive both against Microsoft's offering and Android / iOS devices
      Microsoft makes enough profits from Windows and Office still, but unless something dramatically changes there is no future for them.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by artivision View Post
        Well, Windows and closed source, probably will not exist after 3-5 years. So nvidia must invest on "Socialist/Free".
        Windows have been here for over 25 years ago. It has a dominance on the market. It is here to stay, Windows is not going anywhere.
        Microsoft is not like Google who launches a service and drops it a year later. Microsoft is strongly committed to their products, which is why they're trusted and relied on so much. Microsoft's support makes Ubuntu's LTS releases look like a joke. Windows XP was released 10 years ago, and it will still be supported for 2 more years.

        As for Linus Torvalds, he don't care about politics, socialism or free software. Linus cares about developing a good kernel and finds the open source software development model to be well suited for that.


        Originally posted by Aleve Sicofante View Post
        I'm with you. While this is a very frequent issue in most technical sites, Phoronix is probably the worst offender.

        Michael, seriously, there are many different colors. Make them easily distinguishable. It's not that difficult.
        Michael does not pick the colors, its scripted by some crappy algorithm.
        Presumably it was worse before, and they actually "improved" the color pick function, but it still sucks.
        Patches to Phoronix Test Suite are welcome.

        I actually tried write a improved variant, but it has not been merged. Maybe it is not so good, but maybe it is at least better than the current implementation.
        It uses HSL color rotation. But someone told me HSL have a problem that it does not map colors all that good.
        PHP Code:
        <?php

        $items_to_benchmark 
        16;
        $h 0;
        $s 100;
        $l 50;

        if (
        $items_to_benchmark 8) {
          
        $increase_hue_by 360 $items_to_benchmark;
        } else {
          
        $increase_hue_by 45;
        }

        for (
        $i 0$i $items_to_benchmark$i++) {
          if (
        $h == 360) {
            
        $s -= 33;
            
        $l += 10;
          }
          
        $color "hsl($h$s%, $l%)";
          echo 
        "<div style=\"background-color: $color\">&nbsp;</div>\n";
          
        $h += $increase_hue_by;
        }  

        ?>
        Try the code, write a patch and send it in.


        Originally posted by boast View Post
        Time to cancel steam on linux. Seems most users won't be able to run the games anyways.
        Those with Nvidia cards surely will.


        Originally posted by scottishduck View Post
        That would be about 2 years ago.
        Well, depends on what you do.
        AMD have more cores, so might be good for multi-threaded stuff like raytracing. While Intel might be better at gaming.


        Originally posted by thofke View Post
        In that document are some nice easy distinguishable colors.
        Or maybe the Tango color scheme?
        http://tango.freedesktop.org/Tango_I...eme_Guidelines


        Originally posted by chithanh View Post
        Microsoft makes enough profits from Windows and Office still, but unless something dramatically changes there is no future for them.
        Microsoft is working a lot on the cloud with Azure.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by uid313 View Post
          Presumably it was worse before, and they actually "improved" the color pick function, but it still sucks.
          Patches to Phoronix Test Suite are welcome.

          I actually tried write a improved variant, but it has not been merged. Maybe it is not so good, but maybe it is at least better than the current implementation.
          It uses HSL color rotation. But someone told me HSL have a problem that it does not map colors all that good.
          PHP Code:
          <?php

          $items_to_benchmark 
          16;
          $h 0;
          $s 100;
          $l 50;

          if (
          $items_to_benchmark 8) {
            
          $increase_hue_by 360 $items_to_benchmark;
          } else {
            
          $increase_hue_by 45;
          }

          for (
          $i 0$i $items_to_benchmark$i++) {
            if (
          $h == 360) {
              
          $s -= 33;
              
          $l += 10;
            }
            
          $color "hsl($h$s%, $l%)";
            echo 
          "<div style=\"background-color: $color\">&nbsp;</div>\n";
            
          $h += $increase_hue_by;
          }  

          ?>
          Try the code, write a patch and send it in.
          The problem as I said before with your algo is that immediately you need to know how many colors you'll end up picking. but pts_Graph won't know that until later on and if doing real-time changes you may end up needing more colors after the fact. The current implementation is also using HSL.
          Michael Larabel
          http://www.michaellarabel.com/

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by uid313 View Post
            Windows have been here for over 25 years ago. It has a dominance on the market. It is here to stay, Windows is not going anywhere.
            Windows PCs will still continue to exist, just as TVs still exist in the age of the Internet, and horse carriages continued to exist after the automobile was invented. But they are stagnating, while smartphones, tablets and similar devices enjoy massive growth.
            Originally posted by uid313 View Post
            Microsoft is not like Google who launches a service and drops it a year later. Microsoft is strongly committed to their products, which is why they're trusted and relied on so much. Microsoft's support makes Ubuntu's LTS releases look like a joke. Windows XP was released 10 years ago, and it will still be supported for 2 more years.
            Do I need to remind you about Microsoft Kin? PlaysForSure? Zune? (Yeah, they tried twice.) The Windows Mobile Marketplace?
            Originally posted by uid313 View Post
            Microsoft is working a lot on the cloud with Azure.
            They are investing a lot of money, but whether Azure becomes profitable remains to be seen.
            Last edited by chithanh; 07-06-2012, 06:52 AM.

            Comment


            • #36
              OilRush

              Originally posted by Redi44 View Post
              According to their forum the new Intel HD 4000 should be capable of playing OilRush on HD [1280x720] resolution. Altrought they say that the drivers are "problematic".
              BTW the thread on their website was started by me, because I found that game in one gameshop in the UK and wanted to support them. You can found the thread here.
              In the meantime it even works on the open radeon driver, but with very low fps. On mid quality with ~10-20fps and AA needs to be turned off.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by disi View Post
                In the meantime it even works on the open radeon driver, but with very low fps. On mid quality with ~10-20fps and AA needs to be turned off.
                Numbers for Radeon 6670 (mid quality preset):
                open source R600g 1920x1080 ~15fps
                open source R600g 1280x720 ~30fps
                Catalyst 1920x1080 ~60fps

                Comment


                • #38
                  Intel for new laptop?

                  I've been trying to follow this because I'm looking for a new laptop (desktop replacement). Currently have 17" hp dv9000. I've used nvidia for years (blobs).

                  What should I look for in a laptop with Intel graphics that has:

                  good linux support
                  performance sufficient for desktop effects, perhaps the occasional game (I'm not a gamer).

                  I'm not a gamer, but want something future-proof for 4-5 years.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Michael View Post
                    The problem as I said before with your algo is that immediately you need to know how many colors you'll end up picking. but pts_Graph won't know that until later on and if doing real-time changes you may end up needing more colors after the fact. The current implementation is also using HSL.
                    Just stop trusting "clever" algorithms, export the data and put them inside Calc.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by kwahoo View Post
                      Numbers for Radeon 6670 (mid quality preset):
                      open source R600g 1920x1080 ~15fps
                      open source R600g 1280x720 ~30fps
                      Catalyst 1920x1080 ~60fps
                      Jupp, I had about the same experience: http://www.x.org/wiki/RadeonProgram
                      Still not really playable with 15fps on full screen and the AA problem... that's why silver.
                      Last edited by disi; 07-06-2012, 07:46 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by nbecker View Post
                        I've been trying to follow this because I'm looking for a new laptop (desktop replacement). Currently have 17" hp dv9000. I've used nvidia for years (blobs).

                        What should I look for in a laptop with Intel graphics that has:

                        good linux support
                        performance sufficient for desktop effects, perhaps the occasional game (I'm not a gamer).

                        I'm not a gamer, but want something future-proof for 4-5 years.
                        Just don't buy AMD graphics or make sure you can switch them off. I wouldn't buy Nvidia either, unless you really need very high graphics performance; not because they don't work but just because it's a waste of money (the binary blob is fine with pro 3D apps in my experience; I don't game). Desktop effects have been perfectly fluid with Intel graphics for years so it's a no brainer if you're going to do just mild gaming.

                        Intel's HD4000 is as future proof as you can get. They will stay open and provide excellent performance for low-end games.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          First of all, I don't say things based on believes. Windows and most closed-source will extinct in 3-5 years, analysts say. 1)Small devices like tablets, phones, goggles, watches, will crash desktops and laptops, in less than 3 years estimation 70/30, and completely in 5 years. 2)Windows will have less than 30% on small devices, as analysts say and that will also decrease in 5 years. 3)The last stronghold/fortress of windows and closed-source "gaming" is also falling. I have laptops with all gpu-vendors and I play "blade_and_soul" full speed via WineHQ, and thats because all new graphics-machines are api-less. 4)My personal estimation is that many people will wake up in the next 5 years, when they understand that any one who uses windows is stupid, except if one is forced by his job.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by nbecker View Post
                            I've been trying to follow this because I'm looking for a new laptop (desktop replacement). Currently have 17" hp dv9000. I've used nvidia for years (blobs).

                            What should I look for in a laptop with Intel graphics that has:

                            good linux support
                            performance sufficient for desktop effects, perhaps the occasional game (I'm not a gamer).

                            I'm not a gamer, but want something future-proof for 4-5 years.
                            I have an i3 with HD 3000 and I'm perfectly content with it. I don't game on my machine much though.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by nbecker View Post
                              I've been trying to follow this because I'm looking for a new laptop (desktop replacement). Currently have 17" hp dv9000. I've used nvidia for years (blobs).

                              What should I look for in a laptop with Intel graphics that has:

                              good linux support
                              performance sufficient for desktop effects, perhaps the occasional game (I'm not a gamer).

                              I'm not a gamer, but want something future-proof for 4-5 years.
                              Use either Intel or AMD graphics. With the nVidia binary (the only official driver), I had always problems with external monitors etc. And oh, after ~10 years they finally support xrandr in their blob

                              Radeon has better/faster hardware than Intel at the moment, both have open drivers and are well integrated into the system. The limitation on heavy 3D gaming are not so much the drivers but MESA and lack of recent OpenGL support. For desktop usage the open drivers are just great, I can plug whatever I want into the laptop (and soon also USB GPU?!?), it just works... suspend to RAM, hibernation, never a black screen etc.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by disi View Post
                                Use either Intel or AMD graphics. With the nVidia binary (the only official driver), I had always problems with external monitors etc. And oh, after ~10 years they finally support xrandr in their blob

                                Radeon has better/faster hardware than Intel at the moment, both have open drivers and are well integrated into the system. The limitation on heavy 3D gaming are not so much the drivers but MESA and lack of recent OpenGL support. For desktop usage the open drivers are just great, I can plug whatever I want into the laptop (and soon also USB GPU?!?), it just works... suspend to RAM, hibernation, never a black screen etc.
                                AFAIK, AMD open source graphics have serious issues with power, as well as suspend and hibernate (might work for you, might not work on other systems). I wouldn't advice anyone to go that route for a laptop.

                                Comment

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