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  • #46
    Originally posted by RealNC View Post
    You only have the right to receive support for whatever was promised to you. If you buy something that advertises Linux support, then you have the right to that support. If Linux is not mentioned, then Linux support is not one of your rights.
    Indeed. Precisely so.

    This is the precise reason why the Radeon open source driver, written by the open source community from programming specifications provided by AMD/ATI, is by far the best bet.

    Not only is the AMD/ATI underlying hardware far better value for money, but this driver is the ONLY driver for which the ongoing ability to support it, and the capability to fix issues according to their own priorities, lies with the open source community and not with the OEM of the GPU.

    nVidia were able to drop support for legacy GPUs in their nvidia closed binary driver, and ATI could do the same for their closed fglrx driver, but this can't and won't happen for the open source Radeon driver from Xorg.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by RealNC View Post
      You mean to say that Intel also lacks power management and video acceleration? OK, I didn't know that. From what I've been reading here, Intel drivers were supporting those extremely important features.
      No, I mean to say that the Radeon open source drivers don't lack support for power management,

      http://www.x.org/wiki/RadeonFeature#...gement_Options

      and the issue of the programming specifications for UVD video acceleration hardware being withheld (probably because of DRM associated with HDCP over HDMI) is being worked around using the 3D features of the GPUs. This approach will hopefully bring accelerated video decoding even to legacy GPUs which lack such support embedded in the hardware directly.

      Once again, for the Radeon open source drivers, the aims and directions of the code development are not decided by the OEM of the GPU. This is simply not the case for any other graphics driver for Linux except Nouveau, which is constrained instead by the need to reverse engineer.
      Last edited by hal2k1; 02-08-2012, 04:36 AM.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by hal2k1 View Post
        No, I mean to say that the Radeon open source drivers don't lack support for power management,

        http://www.x.org/wiki/RadeonFeature#...gement_Options
        Looks good. Didn't know they got it working. It never worked for me. even using latest Git versions of the driver. Even if I use the low profile, my temps are around 80C. With Catalyst, they go down to low 70's.

        Maybe it only works on mobile GPUs, no idea. Phoronix should do a power management benchmark on this; Intel vs AMD and see which one provides lower power consumption.

        and the issue of the programming specifications for UVD video acceleration hardware being withheld (probably because of DRM associated with HDMI) is being worked around using the 3D features of the GPUs. This approach will hopefully bring accelerated video decoding even to legacy GPUs which lack such support embedded in the hardware directly.
        So OK, in some years from now, AMD will be just as good as Intel. Not right now though.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by RealNC View Post
          Looks good. Didn't know they got it working. It never worked for me. even using latest Git versions of the driver. Even if I use the low profile, my temps are around 80C. With Catalyst, they go down to low 70's.

          Maybe it only works on mobile GPUs, no idea. Phoronix should do a power management benchmark on this; Intel vs AMD and see which one provides lower power consumption.


          So OK, in some years from now, AMD will be just as good as Intel. Not right now though.
          On my only AMD/ATI-based netbook, temperature runs at 69-70 dgeC.

          The support for video decode acceleration and VDPAU is almost there.

          http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=OTY2OQ

          http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=OTQ1MQ

          XvMC support has landed

          http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=ODcxOA

          So it won't be "a few years".

          I see you have no comment on the most salient points.

          1. AMD/ATI hardware is far better bang-for-buck

          2. For the Radeon open source drivers, the aims and directions of the code development are not decided by the OEM of the GPU. This is simply not the case for any other graphics driver for Linux except Nouveau, which is constrained instead by the need to reverse engineer.
          Last edited by hal2k1; 02-08-2012, 05:07 AM.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by hal2k1 View Post
            On my only AMD/ATI-based netbook, temperature runs at 69-70 dgeC.

            The support for video decode acceleration and VDPAU is almost there.

            http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=OTY2OQ

            http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...item&px=OTQ1MQ
            I'll believe it when it works :-)

            XvMC support has landed
            No one cares about that. H.264 is where battery power goes.

            So it won't be "a few years".
            Again, I'll believe it when it works. And what do you expect anyway? Someone asks me what laptop to buy and I tell them one with AMD graphics? When they put Linux on it and wonder why stuff doesn't work, they're going to kill me. I'm suggesting what works *now*. That is what's important. Intel is a very safe bet right now. And if they want to run 3D games on it, I'm recommending NVidia. Under no circumstance can I truly recommend AMD as of this moment. If I did, they would come back 3 days later and throw their problematic laptop at my face.

            I see you have no comment on the most salient points.

            1. AMD/ATI hardware is far better bang-for-buck
            On Windows. This is a Linux forum and we're talking about the open source driver. The open source AMD driver is slow.

            2. For the Radeon open source drivers, the aims and directions of the code development are not decided by the OEM of the GPU. This is simply not the case for any other graphics driver for Linux except Nouveau, which is constrained instead by the need to reverse engineer.
            I don't see how this is important. Not a single person where I installed Linux on his/her machine even cared about the license of the driver. The only thing they care is that it works.
            Last edited by RealNC; 02-08-2012, 05:20 AM.

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            • #51
              @sabriah

              If you really run fglrx you can certainly show me how you use skype with xserver 1.11 + fglrx.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Kano View Post
                ...how you use skype with xserver 1.11 + fglrx.
                IMHO AMD shouldn't waste development resources to support proprietary Microsoft crap programs under Linux
                Mumble is a good free and open alternative to this.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Fenrin View Post
                  IMHO AMD shouldn't waste development resources to support proprietary Microsoft crap programs under Linux
                  Mumble is a good free and open alternative to this.
                  No, it is not. Mumble is not a P2P VoiP solution. Mumble and Skype are vastly different from each other and have different purposes and uses.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Fenrin View Post
                    IMHO AMD shouldn't waste development resources to support proprietary Microsoft crap programs under Linux
                    Mumble is a good free and open alternative to this.
                    Application type does not matter, so long it is using standartized libraries and calls.

                    Skype is widely used for corporate communications (donīt ask), primary because its easy to work with.
                    So, if MS drops Skype (edit: I mean from linux, linux version support), some companies will switch to Ekiga, xmpp voip and similar.
                    Last edited by crazycheese; 02-08-2012, 06:47 AM.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by RealNC View Post
                      No, it is not. Mumble is not a P2P VoiP solution. Mumble and Skype are vastly different from each other and have different purposes and uses.
                      fair enough! But then he could still use his phone... [/ironymode]

                      thanks for clarifying.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Fenrin View Post
                        IMHO AMD shouldn't waste development resources to support proprietary Microsoft crap programs under Linux
                        That's one of the biggest problems with Linux fanboys. You can't have 2% market share on desktops and act like the rest of the world doesn't exist because it's closed source.
                        And any manufacturer should bend over backwards to support stuff people use.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Kano View Post
                          @sabriah

                          If you really run fglrx you can certainly show me how you use skype with xserver 1.11 + fglrx.
                          nothing special i do have a customer with radeon driver and catalyst driver and they wonder why they can't use some software with the catalyst.
                          he do have a ipod and use kubuntu but he can not open the musik software Banshee to manage his ipod musik because of the Catalyst.
                          on the other pc with the radeon driver it works well...

                          in fact the catalyst is just a waste of money!..

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by bug77 View Post
                            That's one of the biggest problems with Linux fanboys. You can't have 2% market share on desktops and act like the rest of the world doesn't exist because it's closed source.
                            And any manufacturer should bend over backwards to support stuff people use.
                            Linux fanboys have nothing to do with it. You sure mean opensource purists.
                            While opensource IS good, I personally have no problem with closed source as long as it fills ALL of above:
                            [x] supported (incl. bugs and security)
                            [x] known not to have malware or spyware
                            [x] does not impose or represent itself as a standard protocol
                            [x] has free alternative (no matter with what feature difference)

                            For example, if I use inkscape and other guy coreldraw, and if we can both exchange SVGs - I have no problem with coreldraw.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post
                              ...musik software Banshee...
                              Kill it with fire!!!

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by crazycheese View Post
                                Kill it with fire!!!
                                i don't use it... and i don't buy apple products but he need it for his ipod.

                                but catalyst makes it imposable

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