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Fedora 17 Doesn't Change The Apple MacBook Pro

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  • Fedora 17 Doesn't Change The Apple MacBook Pro

    Phoronix: Fedora 17 Doesn't Change The Apple MacBook Pro

    Following yesterday's OS X 10.8 Mountain Lion vs. Ubuntu Linux benchmarks and the OS X vs. Linux power consumption results after that, some wondered whether Ubuntu was to blame for the poor Linux showing on the Apple hardware. Unfortunately, Ubuntu isn't alone and here's some fresh data from Fedora 17 on the MacBook Pro...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=MTE2NzQ

  • #2
    Is it possible for a HW agnostic OS like Linux to beat a HW specific OS when it comes to Power Consumption. I assume that Linux would require quite some tweaking to perform the same.

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    • #3
      Just a thought

      Michael, could you rerun the power tests under Fedora 17 KDE? Dont have to post an article about it if you dont want, but just a link to the results would be nice. I ask because Compiz/Unity have been refactored like crazy in the recent year or so, Gnome (mutter) got a major makeover with the 3.x, im curious to see what Kwin is doing since that codebase has been in the "optimization" stage of development for a couple of years now, plus Martin has even made a few blog posts directly related to Kwin/KDE power management. Atleast this would help in regards to narrowing down what is causing the increased power usage, whether its terminal-userspace (background processes) vs graphical userspace (Gnome/KDE/Unity) vs all in the kernel.

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      • #4
        It doesn't make sense at all if the author used opensource graphics driver for testing. It's well known that opensource drivers suck at power management.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by ArtKun View Post
          It doesn't make sense at all if the author used opensource graphics driver for testing. It's well known that opensource drivers suck at power management.
          Good point ArtKun, the only exception being Intel at this point, right? If these tests werent with blob AMD or blob Nvidia the tests are fairly unbalanced.
          Last edited by Ericg; 08-24-2012, 11:38 AM. Reason: typo fix

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          • #6
            I'm surprised that Michael hasn't done his research on this.

            Obviously the power savings on a Macbook Pro will come from using the on-board Intel HD graphics, and disabling the discrete graphics. To do this, you need to:

            1. Boot in EFI mode
            2. Switch GMUX so that the Intel card will output to the screen
            3. Disable discrete GPU (ATI/NVidia depending on model)

            It's not bad with kernel 3.5, but earlier kernels required patches to make this work properly.

            I can now achieve 12W idling on my 2011 Macbook Pro and about 5 hrs battery life!

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            • #7
              Originally posted by 89c51 View Post
              Is it possible for a HW agnostic OS like Linux to beat a HW specific OS when it comes to Power Consumption. I assume that Linux would require quite some tweaking to perform the same.
              Absolutely it's very possible despite what the appleites and consolers might tell you. The main issue is drivers, which unless someone says otherwise I'm going to assume that the MBP 2010 was their usual Intel IGP + Nvidia gpu, which means yeah... no optimus yet and nouveau not really being set up for power management yet, of course it's going to be more power hungry. The other issue is potentially undocumented EFI hacks that Apple might be using. Since they do control the entire stack it is very possible for them to have EFI and thus ACPI weirdness in an attempt to cut out people from running other OSes on their systems, or at the very least to cast them in a worse light.

              This said let's see KDE and also Windows results out of curiosity.

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              • #8
                Why is Windows 8 not part of the upcoming comparison? The RTM version has been out for over a week. It's only fair especially since you're comparing Ubuntu 12.10 which is very far from being released officially. It's pretty easy to get a Windows 8 ISO from TechNet (I can provide that for you), then get a CDKey from a torrent just to install it. As long as you don't activate the OS, the pirated key shouldn't be a problem. You can go 30 days before you need to activate a Windows 8 installation with a CDKey. Unfortunately, you need to put in a BS key before the install starts unlike Windows 7.

                2 versions of OS X, 2 versions of Ubuntu, 2 versions of Windows. Makes perfect sense.
                Last edited by elg2001; 08-24-2012, 01:59 PM. Reason: added last paragraph

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                • #9
                  I'm really REALLY getting tired of you yapping about your worthless faggotbook.

                  ENOUGH ALREADY, NOBODY GIVES A SHIT ABOUT GARBAGE!!!!

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                    I'm really REALLY getting tired of you yapping about your worthless faggotbook.

                    ENOUGH ALREADY, NOBODY GIVES A SHIT ABOUT GARBAGE!!!!
                    Now now, there are far more sophisticated ways of making fun of his Hipsterbook wannaBeAPro. You could even point out the new Apple product: the iDiot. Point is it's more fun if you aren't so blunt, and are more witty.

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                    • #11
                      OSX only needs to be sufficient enough to flood kickstarter with a bunch of really horrible album ideas from starbucks wifi. Scale Linux back to this point and you'll get 10000hours of battery life.

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                      • #12
                        A sure sign somebody hasn't actually used Mac OS/X.

                        Originally posted by droidhacker View Post
                        I'm really REALLY getting tired of you yapping about your worthless faggotbook.

                        ENOUGH ALREADY, NOBODY GIVES A SHIT ABOUT GARBAGE!!!!
                        Such a failure so brightly demonstrated is often a sign of ignorance, take the time to actually use a Mac Book and you will find that they are very high performance platforms and well worth considering for development or other significant tasks. In many ways they are the ideal platform for power users as UNIX is never far away.

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                        • #13
                          I suppose all of those engineers at NASA really don't use their Macs.

                          I mean really a NASA engineer has no need for a powerful and reliable computer. After all putting a rover on Mars is child's play. Like wise developers in general haven't flocked to the Mac because they need to access Star Bucks WiFi (even if a god cup of coffee is a morning kick starter), nope it might have something to do with a stable platform that doesn't need constant handholding. It might also be to do with state of the art Java and compiler support.

                          Originally posted by moonlitfire View Post
                          OSX only needs to be sufficient enough to flood kickstarter with a bunch of really horrible album ideas from starbucks wifi. Scale Linux back to this point and you'll get 10000hours of battery life.
                          Yeah sure!

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                          • #14
                            Why the hell is it that people can't judge products based on their merit instead of on colloquial perception?

                            Overall, Apple makes great hardware. They really do. Look at the iPad 3; GPU-wise, nothing comes close, AND it has a better screen, AND it has better battery life. Macbook Pros tend to have similar advantages, especially in battery life.

                            The downsides (in my eyes) are that OS X is very poor at memory management and overall is much slower than Windows or Linux. The GUI looks fancy, but usability is poor. However, they do have EXCELLENT font rendering. If Linux worked well on Macbook Pros, I think that would be the ultimate combination once Wayland-only desktop environments become feasible. Oh and I almost forgot the most important downside: their computers are EXPENSIVE. The iPad3 is very reasonable though; cheap, even (for what's in it).

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by wizard69 View Post
                              I mean really a NASA engineer has no need for a powerful and reliable computer. After all putting a rover on Mars is child's play. Like wise developers in general haven't flocked to the Mac because they need to access Star Bucks WiFi (even if a god cup of coffee is a morning kick starter), nope it might have something to do with a stable platform that doesn't need constant handholding. It might also be to do with state of the art Java and compiler support.



                              Yeah sure!
                              Well I guess that explains the utter failure that was the Ares Rockets, and the Constellation program in general.

                              But could it perhaps be that they're purchasing Macs because #1. They got Rich and decided to go for the most expensive thing out there because of it, and #2 They were managed to have been pulled in by the Apple marketing department that's calling it's users iDiots and sophisticated in the same breath?

                              Honestly what their marketing department has managed to pull is rather interesting, Essentially they play into the user's fears about computers, while saying "you could look smart and sophisticated while using this because it's the computer for stupid people". And thus we result in all these claims of userfriendliness and such when it's a system designed by sadists for masochists.

                              It's still fundamentally the same broken interface design from the 70s they stole via purchasing copies of Xerox's OS and REing it, yeah it's been prettied up some but the actual interface itself never changed, and their periphreals are utterly awful, their keyboards are hand breaking and their touchpads and mice are a joke, from there the internals themselves are those that run for about half the price or less usually. So this leaves us with the case, the display, and the internals of the OS. Now the Display is gotten from LG which means that other than the "retina" displays which are limited to their 13.3in and below because of cost of said panels they're nothing special. LG Panels aren't bad but they're not something I would associate with the word premium. So then we got their cases, the design of the cases they use in general is rather ill conceived and lead to heat issues to the point of people getting burned, besides them being heavy and aluminum being something that dents easily vs plastic and in general it's just yuck. If you want to use aluminum do it like HP does with dv6, which is to say light, it's being used for heatsyncing purposes and it uses the strengths of both metal and plastic in the design of the machines. This just leaves the underlying OS which as shown in the recent article boils down to there not really being a performance advantage and the power savings advantage has to do with GPU switching, So yeah...


                              As far as the iPad 3 goes It's screen is actually inferior to the iPad in terms of coloration because it's more yellow, and the actual image quality itself hasn't really improved from what people say. To be blunt people have to look very closely for the coloration differences to be able to visually tell the difference between an iPad 2 and an iPad 3. We're not exactly talking a desktop where more pixels really translates over into more space to work with because in the tablet paradigm everything is full screened. The rendering performance is worse because while they're using a twice as fast GPU, they're pushing 4x as many pixels vs the iPad 2, which effectively means having 1/2 of the performance when all is said and done. This of course has brought about heat and overheating issues because of their ill conceived cooling and case designs

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